Check out: http://johnnyedge.blogspot.com/2010/11/these-events-took-place-roughly-between.html

An interesting post by someone a few days ago about an encounter they had with the TSA security people at an American airport.

This guy talks about (and has some footage/audio of himself) the TSA attempting to make him walk through one of those x-ray machines we've been hearing about for a while now.

He was randomly chosen to go through the scanner (instead of the metal detector); and he opted out of that because of the risks he perceved them to have; and also refused a pat down that involved a grope - not just a regular pat down -but accepted going through a metal detector as if he was not selected in the first place.

He then attempts to leave the airport and some security people try and force him to walk through them or face a civil suit of $10,000 and other misc threats.

I'm glad we don't have that sort of stuff here in Australia (yet...?) as its just ridiculous; and from reading his article I would hope those with the threats and other obvious power trip bulls*** were just fired.

While we are on the subject of American airline security, it seems that japan

has been forced to indefinitely stop accepting any items over 453g (16 freedom ounces) in weight for air shipment to the US or its various island territories.

Apparantly due to stop all the bombs those democracy hating japanese are sending.

Those x-ray machines freak me out.

I would do a strip search provided I had time, always a laugh, I've had enough from the QLD police to be comfortable.

F*** getting blasted by x-rays, there's a reason the operators are behind f***off lead shields.

Seriously stop being f*****s and just let them cop a feel of your nads and move on.

got kids? is it alright if they search your kids for "bombs" in the same way because you could be hiding them in their clothes? how about your wife / girlfriend?

Are there any reports saying just how many rems (or whatever) you are exposed to when you walk through the x-ray machines?

Cool so if you followed them closely you can link me up with something that shows how much radiation you are exposed to when you are scanned.

Cool so if you followed them closely you can link me up with something that shows how much radiation you are exposed to when you are scanned

I can't even remember what I did last week, let alone multiple years ago when I was interested in this s***.

All I know is if I had the option of the x-ray or a quick strip search, I would do the later.

Stripped search != cavity search.

Them poke around your penis/balls/bumhole for 5 seconds and you're good to go, the bad fact is it's always a male :S

Never had a cavity search so I can't comment.

I'll have to take your word for it, I haven't traveled to the US.

Yeah heard this on ABC radio this morning; the guy sounds like he's just trying to get a bit of fast fame, I've been to the US twice in the last two years and their airport security is fine they got to do what they got to do because if they don't who gets the blame with another plane gets hijacked?
He's paid for a airfare to wherever he is going, made plans to be there then throws it all away to prove a point that he doesn't want to be searched the guy is lucky he wasn't locked up on terrorist charges!

can't they just x-ray the mulims?

These full body scan units don't give off radiation like normal x-ray machines, AFAIK because they use electromagnetic waves to get the image theres no ionizing radiation.

Confirm/deny?

I just got back from Sacramento/Napa and I planned my trip specifically to make sure all airports I passed through did not have the back scatter machines in them.

f***.that.s***.

I have to point out it's rare for TSA workers to be as bad as the OP makes them out to be. Every time I've been to America they've mostly been friendly and helpful to me, even with matters of security. I've had a couple of random patdowns (not full ones though), random bag searches, bomb material checks etc and they've all been courteous towards me.

As an aside, the dude comes off as a d***. It's a condition of flight that you may be subject to such security checks, if he didn't agree he shouldn't have bought airline tickets and instead used another form of transportation. The TSA seemed to act professionally towards him but he was being stubborn and all "stick it to the man, yeah!"

Deyyyy tooook ouuuurrrrr liberrrrtyyyyy. Damn fgt communist red government! Oh wait, no .. no ... not you China, I love you, keep trading with me!

This has been happening for f*****g years at sporting events and concerts where you can be patted down.

But didn't you hear? Some random dude on the intertoobs said that it's not a normal pat down, that they're designed so you will go through the scanner next time!1 I hear they fondle your gonads while forcing you to watch a video of them raping your grandmother set to a Bjork theme.

The main issue I've had with security personal in the US (Not only TSA, but any form for law enforcement there) is that so many of the ones I've observed absolutely suck at diplomacy. They know the extent of their power and they seem to like just going straight to authority mode instead of trying the easy way first -- you know, actually taking a brief second to explain to someone why it is exactly that they're being ordered to do something.

As far as the X-Ray Scanners go. Apparently they do expose the user to an amount of radiation and pilot unions are getting pretty vocal about it.

"The principal issue is not only privacy. It's total radiation exposure," he said.

"The allowable limit for radiation workers is 20 mSv per annum. And the average pilot, depending on where they're flying, gets between three and six.

"For instance, if you fly to London or over to South America it's equivalent to a chest X-ray every time you fly.

"So radiation is cumulative and going through these machines would just add to the radiation, the total radiation the crew are getting exposed to."

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2010/11/09/3061799.htm

But then, your average passenger shouldn't have to worry about this. Unless they're a crazy "Up in the Air" style frequent flyer.

http://www.salon.com/technology/ask_the_pilot/2010/11/04/belt_removal_at_security_checkpoint is also interesting - story of an airline pilot trying to get through

http://lib.store.yahoo.net/lib/demotivators/TSAmodel.jpg

when i was leaving london 4 years ago they were trialing the body scanner at heathrow. i was hoping they wouldnt pick me out of the queue to go through it since they had made my friend who was further down the line go through it. i was f*****g lucky, they grabbed the guy infront of me and the one behind me.

last edited by ravn0s at 12:10:47 17/Nov/10

http://www.networkworld.com/community/files/imce/img_blogs/smith-tsa-kids-1st-cavity-search.jpg

hahahaah faceman

So basically all you need to avoid the full body scanners is have someone go ahead of you, chuck up a stink, and then they give everyone else the minimul check because they are too busy with you.

nope. they put you in a queue and you wait until they get to you. that was my experience going through SFO, anyway.

I'm pretty much not keen on ever travelling through an American airport. It is a shame, but if you get off the plane and get put through that s*** as your first experience there, then I don't think that is the sort of country I'd want to go to.

Yeh, this. I have a desire to visit the US and spend some time there.

I'm a law abiding, model citizen. But until they stop treating me like a criminal by default my AUD tourist dorra won't be turning into USD. I wonder if anyone is tracking this s*** and working out how badly its hurting the economy?

This isn't security this is stupidity.

I thought it was Sparta?

Actually its more like a power trip. She has this job thats meant to help people and she's on a power trip so is making it difficult for anyone she feels like making it difficult for. She probably had a low IQ and learning difficulties so took her anger out on you.

You see, if everyone did that^ the system would break down and a different method would have to be used, almost certainly more comfortable for the passenger.
By accepting X-rays at Airports we are opening the door to X-Rays at shopping malls/cinemas/rock concerts/sports stadiums.
Fight the battle today or lose the war tomorrow.
The War on Privacy.

Haha Penn is such a champ, for a while he was pimping this product http://securityedition.com/ It's a piece of metal that has the Bill of Rights printed on it, so there is irony when they try to confiscate it from you at airports.

Hah, that was very good :)

He usually pisses me off.

Understandable faceman.

Children are regularly used in drugs trafficking, along with old people, handicapped and disabled.

It is what it is, people have been packing children, retards and wheelchairs for decades.

haha, prisonplanet.

The link saying 'shocker tsa has been molesting children for years' is patently ridiculous.

http://min.us/iu4yM.jpeg
lols

That's not a strip search Faceman, there's nothing sensitive about a males torso.

A strip search for a male is genitals, for women it includes tits too.

From trog's link:

Exactly two things have made airline travel safer since 9/11: reinforcement of c***pit doors, and passengers who now know that they may have to fight back. Everything else -- Secure Flight and Trusted Traveler included -- is security theater. We would all be a lot safer if, instead, we implemented enhanced baggage security -- both ensuring that a passenger's bags don't fly unless he does, and explosives screening for all baggage -- as well as background checks and increased screening for airport employees.

Then we could take all the money we save and apply it to intelligence, investigation and emergency response. These are security measures that pay dividends regardless of what the terrorists are planning next, whether it's the movie plot threat of the moment, or something entirely different.

QFMFT

I'd be totally pissed off

More like pissed ON, amirite?

Some guy stripped down to his undy-chundys before the pat down and got arrested LOL

Wow, you're joking right?

That should be completely legal.

Surely FaceMan has reached the limits of complete bulls*** allowed to be posted? His last two posts have been a video shown completely out of context, and then just something he has completely made up.

I just got back from the US - the only annoying thing about TSA security were the wait times, but they were comparable to any busy part of an airport. Everyone seemed quite nice and friendly and just wanted to get people through to their flights. I guess you gotta remember that although there are some horror stories, they are outweighed probably 1000:1 by the mundane, nothing-happened-stories.

The protests will likely be a huge non-event, cause there really wasn't anything to protest, IMO.

nothing to protest, except gross violation of civil liberties and the increasing sheepification of the US and the western world as a result of a handful of nutbags almost ten years ago.

I'll be opting for the patdown for sure if I have to go back to the US again

i hang in a few predominantly american irc channels & the yanks are all up in arms against the tsa searches. there is all sorts of talk about civil suits & protests... of course i dunno if they'll match their talk with action.
urls like the one below are coming thick & fast though :p~

http://www.refinery29.com/stick-it-to-tsa-body-scans-with-these-shirts-containing-a-hidden-message.php

So I saw maybe a total of about an hour's worth of TSA security screening, including a view of what I thought was the full body scanner (but not the scan itself). However in that time, I only saw a few people actually in the scan. So I would have thought that even if every person opts out of the scan, it's only going to be a few dozen people each day which won't be a big deal?

heh. i'd hate to be the sanner guy in that... he was copping it sweet. they make an awesome point though that the scanners would be ineffective against many items.

http://www.vagabondish.com/wp-content/uploads/tsa-checkpoint-oleg-volk-800x800.jpg

:P

That's not a strip search Faceman, there's nothing sensitive about a males torso.

A strip search for a male is genitals, for women it includes tits too.

Chub a strip search is the stripping or removal of clothing it's got f*** all to do with what part of the body the clothing is coming off. As long as cloths are being removed it's a strip search. If that wasn't the case it'd be called something completely different.

Nice article by an ex Assistant Chief of the Montgomery County, Maryland, Department of Police on how bad some of the TSA are doing their job.
http://www.gizmodo.com.au/2010/11/why-tsa-practices-could-result-in-public-rebellion-or-terrorist-attack/

I had been told repeatedly I would be subjected to a “pat down”. I correctly suspected otherwise. During the course of my police career, I have conducted many pat-downs on the street. The Supreme Court has described pat downs as a cursory check of the outer clothing of a person by a police officer, upon articulable suspicion that the officer’s safety is at risk of being compromised. My department’s procedure indicated that this pat-down was to be conducted with an open hand, gently patting the outer clothing of an individual, for purposes of officer safety only, with the goal of detecting weapons. In other words, it is not a search.

What happened to me in Albany was not the promised “pat-down”. It was a full search conducted in full public view. It was also one of the most flawed searches I have ever witnessed.

From the outset, it was very clear that the screener would have preferred to be anywhere else. She acted as if she was afraid of me, though given that I had set myself apart as apparently crazy, perhaps I cannot blame her. With rubber-gloved hands she checked my head, my arms, my legs, my buttocks (and discovered a pen that had fallen into one of my pockets) and even the bottom of my feet. Perhaps in a nod to decorum, she did not check my crotch, my armpits or either breast area.

Here was a big problem: an effective search cannot nod to decorum.

Its an interesting read.

I'm opting for the patdown....sensual!

I'm asking this because I think there's an answer: how do you know that the new security measures are the reason that no bombs have been taken on planes?

We do know that there is now less activity in air terrorism, and no major event has occured in the West since increased screening and intelligence work began post-9/11. Woohoo, go team anti-terror!

So it follows that because what we've done so far has WORKED PERFECTLY, we now need to up the ante and scan everyone's junk ...

Can a gay person request a female patdown?

I would rather get groped at the airport then be interfered with in regular life and will happily give up my rights at the airport to avoid getting raided for stupid anti-terrorism s*** in my own home.

Terrible idea.

I'm ok with the security. Even if it isnt effective per se. it gives the appearance of effectiveness which calms the public and deters would-be troublemakers.

I would prefer actual security over the appearance of security any day of the week.

I noticed something odd, the TSA checks seem to be one thing both left and right wing yank media can agree on.

What I want to know is... why not just detonate the bomb the moment they're onto you?

You know you're going to get homeland security rape then multiple life sentences in a supermax till you rot to death.

What exactly do you have to lose?

What I want to know is... why not just detonate the bomb the moment they're onto you?

You know you're going to get homeland security rape then multiple life sentences in a supermax till you rot to death.

What exactly do you have to lose?

that is dealt with in the israeli model (link again is http://www.thestar.com/news/world/article/744199---israelification-high-security-little-bother ), because they realise a bomb going off in the airport on the ground is pretty much almost as bad as one going off on a plane in the air. Arguably it could be worse in terms of overall effect - imagine the slaw that would result if a major airport was shut down for a couple days as a result of a bomb blast, whereas a single plane would presumably not stop most other flights from running

I would get ass-f***ed by that security trog :( not a nice article to read.

I've only been out of Australia 3 times in my lifetime, out of the 6 flights I've been selected 5 times for "extra screening" or whatever the f*** they call it, 1 time I've been taken to a back room for a thorough pat down (not strip).

I don't handle airports well, I'm young, I look like a total grub and I do everything wrong.

It's the same reason I get a vehicle search during traffic stops, I shake like f*** when I give a cop my license for an RBT :(

"Two benign questions. The questions aren't important. The way people act when they answer them is," Sela said.

Officers are looking for nervousness or other signs of "distress" — behavioural profiling. Sela rejects the argument that profiling is discriminatory.

I would shake/look away and display every single sign applicable.

You are now in the terminal. As you approach your airline check-in desk, a trained interviewer takes your passport and ticket. They ask a series of questions: Who packed your luggage? Has it left your side?

I would choke heavily in this situation.

last edited by CHUB at 19:01:08 25/Nov/10

I reckon if a bomb blew up a plane over US soil there would be a very high likelihood of all air traffic being grounded.

yeh definitely in the US... not sure about other countries but I spose on reflection it does seem more likely

and no major event has occurred in the West since increased screening and intelligence work began post-9/11

before 9/11 the only American terrorist threat i could find was the 1988 pan am flight 103 bombing? so until there is no event until 2013 you can't even say there has even been a reduction in aviation terrorism against America.

Unless i've missed something?

The EFF have just posted their take on the body scanners - pretty much what you'd expect:

http://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2010/11/common-sense-and-security-body-scanners

Is trogs link working for anyone?

cheers

Travelled from San Jose to Seattle today on Thanksgiving, arguably one of the busier days for air travel. All back scatter machines were offline, and there were no pat downs.

Interesting.

This is what I'm going to do
solution

http://www.prisonplanet.com/images/november2010/251110landoffree.jpg

Caught 6 flights in the last 3 weeks and went through 0 x-ray machines and had 0 pat downs. Went through standard metal detectors at every screening point though the x-ray scanners were in use, I guess I looked non-threatening enough (despite a darker than average complexion and very foreign sounding last name) to be taken through the metal detectors.

Also was at LAX on National Opt Out Day, but missed the bikini girl in wiggleplix's post above.

New video:

New Mother Harassed and Threatened by TSA because she requests alternate screening for her breast milk. As a repeat traveler, the TSA singled her out to make an example out of her. She spends over an hour in the "Special Inspection" area and is forced to miss her flight.

If what is captioned in the video is true; they really do seem stupid and useless.

S*** that's a pretty distressing vid. Just to be sure though, has anyone actually verified that the TSA policy is as it states in the vid, and that this chick isn't a dodgy person or something?

So I am currently sitting in a lounge at LAX on the way back from GDC in SF.

When in SF I was in the line waiting to go through TSA security. I had stacks of time before my flight and there weren't many people in the line. I could see the TSA magical mwave scanners and all the people dutifully lining up and going through them and getting zapped.

It was amazing, once I was in the line, how fast I had simply acquiesced to the fate that awaited me - that of being scanned, considering that after reading this thread and all the other posts on the Internet had made me certain that, when presented with the opportunity, I would tell the TSA to go f*** themselves and have them scan me. But once you're in The Line, and trudging slowly along with everyone else, you simply absorb their sheep mentality and just keep putting one foot in front of the other with a view of getting through this process as quickly as painlessly as possible.

Which is, of course, what they're counting on - your obedience and willingness to submit yourself to this invasive level of security, because the alternative is an even more invasive one that will take longer and probably be a pain in the ass.

Once I realised my transition to sheeple had almost completed, I snapped myself out of it and mentally swore that I would opt out of the scanning and ask for the patdown.

i got to the front of the line, had my stuff going through the x-ray, and told the guy I would like to opt out, adding casually that "I hope this isn't a pain in the ass" (knowing of course that it definitely was). Looking around though, I could see one TSA guy to my left watching the line and another two guys at the back just talking to each other, so I didn't think this was a particularly onerous request - the line wasn't that long and they clearly weren't very busy as the herd was so docile. The guy responded, with the tinnnnnnnniest air of frustration, that "it takes longer", to which I just shrugged.

So I was taken aside by the spare guy to my left. I assumed that, given he was standing there doing nothing, he would search me, but he simply herded me into a little fenced off area right next to the scanner and called for a male agent to come over.

I had to wait about 3 or 4 minutes before some guy came over. At no time did they express any interest into why I opted out; the dude just wandered over and walked me through the process very clearly, politely and succinctly, explaining exactly what he was going to be doing ("I'll be running my hands up and down blah blah blah").

He offered me a private room, but I declined, deciding that if I was going to get The Patdown, I would prefer to do it in front of everyone, both to remind them of the option, and also because I hoped (no doubt vainly) that it would perhaps encourage others not to so meekly submit to the whims of the TSA.

The search took probably no more than about another 3-4 minutes. At the end of it I decided that at no point did I ever feel like the guy was grasping any part of my genitals or trying to incite a tickle-frenzy; it was like a very polite masseur simply running his hands over most of my body.

The best part was at the end - he invited me to sit down, then ran his hands over the tops of my (shoe-less) feet. While he swabbed his gloves and ran the results through a scanner (presumably checking for explosives, drugs, or other things Americans don't like much, like liberty, freedom, medical care for citizens, etc), I asked him if he was going to check the soles of my feet. He said no, to which I just shrugged acceptance, and then another TSA dude who had been watching the tail end of the proceedings said "no, we don't do that any more because the TSA decided feet are dirty".

I laughed dutifully thinking this was a hilarious joke made by the TSA at their own expense. Neither of the two guys laughed; the other just nodded and said "yeh, that's right", to which I choked down my laughter and just started staring depressed at the floor at the obvious security theatre that was going on around me - regardless of the truth of that statement.

I certainly feel like applying this level of security to every individual is an utter waste of time. While I was waiting in my little fenced off possible-terrorist-suspect area, I witnessed a dude breeze straight through the security check - a fellow passenger who wasn't subject to the screenings or the pat-down, presumably some sort of frequent flier who had a first-class pass that entitled him to only cursory inspection walking through a metal detector. So presumably, if you were a real criminal or terrorist, you would just find out what mechanic they use (Google informs me that it's probably CLEAR) and employ that to skip the onerous security checks.

Of course, that attack vector has long considered as boring and pointless by some security experts, who think that the two biggest improvements to flyer security since 9/11 have been the reinforced c***pit doors and the new passenger knowledge that if they need to act to subdue miscreants or else their lives are almost certainly lost.

So I certainly felt irritated by the process. All the agents that I dealt with were utterly, implacably polite and professional. Again, they were not very busy; there were not hordes of conscientious objectors like me f*****g up their day, so they could take the time to have a relaxed approach - or maybe they're just always like that at SFO because they hire a better class of citizen to help protect their airways, or something.

Anyway, that's my story. I am not sure if I would do it again - it was almost creepy how strong the urge to "just do what everyone else is doing" was. But I think it's important that people take a stand on security like this so that the focus can be shifted to mechanisms that really work and actually contribute to the security of all, instead of merely providing an appearance of security.

Whats the deal with clear? you pay to bypass the security checks, surely thats not right, that just seems too easy?

Of course. You didn't think they'd forget to include a quick way for the patricians to bypass the plebeian queue did you?
God bless America!

I just went through like a good sheep, I don't need the hassle, I already look dodgy

haha airport security in some sth american places i went was a joke,

a guy would be there picking out a person every 10 passengers, put them through a metal detector and bags through a scanner and that was it. Everyone else just walked straight off the plane grabbed their s*** and left, no security checks, pat downs or anytihng.

Was amazing =)

Very over gettin 'randomly' pulled aside for explosive swabs etc. waste of f***** time and i cant stand the airport security and their power trips.

Got pulled up last yr comin back from sth america, guy was takin ages, looked through every single thing we had in out bags. I was laughing with my misses saying how stupid this is etc, the guy looked up with this rambo look on his face "mate this is no laughing matter, this is serious! u better check ur attitude before we have to go into a private room"

f***** twat telling me what frame of mind i should b in. After a 16hr flight, gettin harrassed for 1hr and all my s*** being looked through i think that me laughing was a much better reaction than showing how i really felt towards him and the situation.

So apparently we can take liquids on domestic flights now? Is this a recent change, or has this never been policy for domestic, only international? I just came back from Cairns and took a water bottle, ice pack, and other liquids in my carry on. And yet I had to take my umbrella out and put it in a separate tray?

i think it is when you just "let" it happen and accept it in ur head, normal males should b kickboxing the guy in their imagination

oh look a PrisonPlanet own story.
http://www.prisonplanet.com/states-rebeling-against-tsa-texas-the-latest-to-legislate-for-banning-grope-downs-naked-scanners.html

Legislation has been introduced into the Texas House of Representatives that directly challenges the authority of the TSA in airports within the state, specifically aimed at criminalizing the use of naked body scanners and enhanced pat-downs.

Rep. David Simpson (R-Longview) introduced a set of bills earlier this week that would empower the Texas Attorney General to bring suit in court against any airport operator who installs or uses the full body imaging equipment or any operator who touches a person without consent and searches them without probable cause.

The bills, HB 1938 and HB 1937 would see criminal and civil penalties handed out to any TSA worker who was found to have contravened the laws.

This why you resist.
If enough people do it you can effect change.


http://www.prisonplanet.com/images/january2011/050111TSA.jpg

So apparently we can take liquids on domestic flights now? Is this a recent change, or has this never been policy for domestic, only international? I just came back from Cairns and took a water bottle, ice pack, and other liquids in my carry on. And yet I had to take my umbrella out and put it in a separate tray?

Domestic is fine, its only International.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D3nGbFCxFN4&feature=player_embedded

I f*****g ROFLED hard

presumably checking for explosives, drugs, or other things Americans don't like much, like liberty, freedom, medical care for citizens, etc

I lol'd