Last night on 60 minutes (international Child Abduction Agency)
There were two Boys who are being encouraged to live like they are Girls, from clothing to speech lessons to Deportment and soon Medical intervention.
http://www.9jumpin.com.au/show/60minutes/stories/2016/emma/

Tonight on Australian Story there is a Boy who has been living as a Girl.
http://www.abc.net.au/austory/content/2016/s4515697.htm

Isnt this the Tail wagging the Dog ?
Arent Parents supposed to guide their Children ?
How can an Adult let a Child believe they can become the opposite Sex ?
Science says thats impossible.

Not opposed to Adults that want to live their lives this way.
Fashion cant change Biology.

We need to talk about: Transgender

No we don't.

I'd rather talk about Aliens.

Stop offending my Cultural Beliefs.
Dont make me summon 18c

Let me explain how much we need to talk about transgender. You see the history of QGL posts - the entire history, up until this point - where from what I can recall, this is the first post in history where we feel the need to talk about this as an 'issue'? That's about the correct amount of discussion that warrants it.

The only time it needs to be more of an issue than it currently is - much more - is if people think it's an issue. And then, the issue will be that they think it's an issue, not that it's literally an issue.

Stop offending my Cultural Beliefs.
Dont make me summon 18c

Don't make me summon the power of Christ.

Umm, there was a kinda epic thread once.

Yeah there was that one time. Maybe not discussed as an "issue" perse.

Genuine question: I thought you fancied yourself as something of a civil libertarian?

But your posts of late seem to just smack of conservatism. The same kind of conservatism that so many US "libertarians" end up spouting, blissfully aware of the irony. When they say "liberty" what they really mean is "liberty to do things my way and believe in the same things that I believe".

Or are you literally just trying to bait out people to make a point about 18c? If so it's boring

"liberty to do things my way and believe in the same things that I believe"

so you mean a Social Justice Warrior?

Conservatism. When it can't defend itself, call lefties SJWs, Kumbaya and other cute names.
Left-wing has a reality bias, cos science & facts n s***.

And conservatives will continue to ignore science for their own gain. Imagine a world without such an ideology holding humanity back.

Want to talk about who b****** about GMO's Vash?

Salmon

Not that faceman has a single original thought in his head, nor deserves to be entertained as if he's doing anything other than regurgitating extreme mental illness talking points from some wasp nest of bulls*** anger, but, gender != sex.

It's like being outraged about power connectors being labeled male or female, or evolution being 'just a theory'.

You must have missed the part where I said Adults can do as they like.

gender != sex.

First one must change the language before one can change the Truth.
Aside from some Intersex people there are only Males and Females.
If you think Gender actually exists then present some Science.
How many Genders are you willing to have Faith in Nerfy ?
4 ? 10 ? 20 ?

come on, a 4 yrold is convinced hes a Girl ?
Whats really going on here ?
http://www.breitbart.com/texas/2016/08/11/texas-mom-transgender-bathroom-rights-4-year-old-life-death-fight/

Why is George Soros funding much of the Trans Theory ?
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2016/aug/11/george-soros-the-money-behind-the-transgender-move/

I think nerf might be referring to the difference between dresses and vaginas man.

That is a Social Construct not actually based in Science.

I came across an interesting quote recently:

'When men choose not to believe in God, they do not thereafter believe in nothing, they then become capable of believing in anything.'

G.K. Chesterton

It always seems to be The far Left coming up with some knew Theory and if we dare challenge it we must be Bigots, Racists, Fascists, Nazis(even though Nazis were Socialists) or that we are just Prejudiced, or funded by Fossil Fuels.

Seriously faceman, I'm saying this as a kindness. You need professional help. You're not ok upstairs.

who is trolling whom here?

You're just feeding his mental illness infi, particularly by throwing around the same sorts of parroted buzzwords that he's been trained to despise.

not sure I follow your logic infi

Hey you're the one who said we weren't discussing politics.

No not really

As long as it isn't done in mockery then sure. Why wouldn't that be acceptable?

So would you be ok with a white person genuinely believing they are indigenous, seeking to live in indigenous settlements, wear indigenous body paints and seek acknowledgement of indigenous ethnicity?

No not really

obtuse heh

I'm not being obtuse infi. I don't understand your point.

There is no reason to beat around the bush. Just make your point clear.

you know in an

A B ->C

A
B
therefore
C

Kind of way.

You're literally just babbling now.

Is it safe to assume you read the transgender/race comparison from some Bolt article or something, repeated it here before failing to internalise it and now that people have scratched its surface you're finding it hard to explain it in any meaningful way? Because you do that all the time and if you ever desire to be seen as a functional adult outside of your dad's office then you should probably stop doing that.

I'm pretty sure deep down I'm a lesbian trapped inside a man's body.

You're free to make your argument clear at any time infi.

SJWs applaud gender fluidity and sex change operations but abhor cultural appropriation. Were a white person to actually say they identify as Indigenous Australian or African-American, despite having no genetic roots, all hell would break loose. Gender is a social cultural norm, then so is ethnicity.

Imagine a white person saying they feel like an African-American or Indigenous Australian trapped in a white body?

Salmon

Nah,Barramundi, they love it.

Yah, back to the original post.

60 minutes has hired out a mansion at Terry Hills and is installing a surgery, and surgical team to make a reality TV show called.

"MasterTransTesticle"

if you see the letters "SJW" in a discussion I reckon there's a 98% chance you want to pull the ejection handles before you get strawmanned to death

The deads***'s who use that term as some sort of abuse are TWNJ = Total Wanker Nut Jobs.

> person of one gender associating themself with another gender, wearing that gender's clothing, changing genitals etc.
> person of one race associating themself with another race, wearing that race's clothing, changing skin colour etc

can you follow now?

I'm not sure, what exactly is wrong with either of these?

The funny thing is convicted racist Andrew Bolt got in trouble for exactly this.

how can Bolts opinion be a Crime ?


last edited by FaceMan at 15:02:55 17/Aug/16

Defamation, slander, harassment, misleading sales claims, etc, are all crimes which can be wrapped up as 'expressing opinions'. Bring ya crocodile tears down to pretend stupid warehouse for a regular customer discount.

it sure wouldn't of

A dude won women's gold medal at the Olympics.

http://pickeringpost.com/story/-/6356

Freedom of Speech for all.
Bad Ideas are defeated by better Ideas
Bad Ideas cant be defeated if we chase them underground or into Mosques.

Untrue.

Take this forum for example (it is close enough to be a platform with freedom of speech in this context). You start by providing a stupid and uninformed opinion, which is then shot down by 95% of other people on the forum. Does this change your mind? Does it make you rethink your position? No, it just hardens your position, and as much as it makes you look like a crazy person and an extremist, you are now committed to defending your position, even if you have an epiphany and realise you are in the wrong.

Untrue.

Take this forum for example (it is close enough to be a platform with freedom of speech in this context). You start by providing a stupid and uninformed opinion, which is then shot down by 95% of other people on the forum. Does this change your mind? Does it make you rethink your position? No, it just hardens your position, and as much as it makes you look like a crazy person and an extremist, you are now committed to defending your position, even if you have an epiphany and realise you are in the wrong.

so, debate and persuasion should be banned. right....

I think the best question to ask is, "what evidence would it take to make you believe that X is/isn't true?" Then you can frame your responses and find out how true that is. Of course the most likely outcome is a shifting of the goalposts or some other logical fallacy. But it's worth a try.

It's more that debates can sometimes be clearly won or lost. Certain people, instead of learning from their losses and updating their knowledge, use willful ignorance as some sort of defense mechanism. Not really sure if it's a pride thing or something else. Care to shed any light?

I can shed some light on the benefit of discussion and ongoing debate. Cultural and societal norms evolve, as do scientific theories. Humans in all their grandiose wisdom have their knowledge enlightened constantly. If the status quo is not permitted to be challenged then we would still have segregation in america and stolen children in Australia. Now we have a whole different raft of problems due to the growth of political correctness and white guilt. Society's heavy dependence on government to protect them and solve their problems needs to be challenged.

The university students sued under 18C dared to question (on the use of indigenous-only computer labs) whether it was appropriate to respond to segregation of indigenous students with more segregation. Now they have been threatened with a $250,000 lawsuit as a result.

So yeah the whole "this argument is totally settled and you're an idiot for having a different opinion, in fact we're going to fine/imprison you" thing. It's actually really dumb.

And if a person's argument doesn't have merit - then the marketplace will figure them out. We don't need a police force to do it.

edit: without healthy ongoing debate we end up like Islam stuck in the 6th century.

It's more that debates can sometimes be clearly won or lost. Certain people, instead of learning from their losses and updating their knowledge, use willful ignorance as some sort of defense mechanism. Not really sure if it's a pride thing or something else. Care to shed any light?

Yeah, the difference is that when I didn't understand transgender, somebody could explain it to me and I changed my mind when I realised that I'd misunderstood the definitions of the words being discussed. When faceman doesn't understand transgender, somebody can explain it to him and he'll insist that there's a conspiracy amongst linguists, urged on by an obvious political and propaganda agenda which has driven him to this position, rather than it being an honest position which he just happened to stumble across due to misunderstanding.

Nah infi I wasn"t interested in your wafflings I was asking you to shed some light on your motives for employing wilful ignorance as a defense mechanism against things that you don't like.

The living stereotype proclaiming that they're not a stereotype is so stereotypical.

ah yes, the growth of political correctness and white guilt, two of the biggest problems facing us today

I'm just going to leave this here. Think some of those 1400 raped children might have a slightly different view on the growth of PC culture or it being confined to twitter? Reckon they might.

had no idea you could just declare yourself the winner of an argument

Sorry I didn't conform to your stereotype.

The behaviour I described that you quoted is something you've demonstrated repeatedly and flagrantly for years and years on here. Pretty safe to assume you also do it in real life. Are you saying that you're actually unaware you're doing it? Or are you going all meta on me by defense mechanisming the defense mechanism?

I'm just going to leave this here. Think some of those 1400 raped children might have a slightly different view on the growth of PC culture or it being confined to twitter? Reckon they might.

reckon you're just cherry picking?

do you really think the kind of PC/white guilt infi is perpetually whining about (e.g., as seen in this OP of this very thread) is a legitimate problem that the world is facing on a daily basis? or is that just one data point in a sea of mostly sad Internet complaining? because I think it's the latter.

I wrote a whole post unpacking infi's confusing statement earlier but deleted it because I just couldn't be bothered but I'll quickly recap:

If the status quo is not permitted to be challenged then we would still have segregation in america and stolen children in Australia. Now we have a whole different raft of problems due to the growth of political correctness and white guilt.

How are those two sentences NOT diametrically opposed?

"We must constantly challenge the status quo to make sure we're fighting bad ideas! ... but, also challenging the status quo has made things suck because now we have political correctness and white guilt, two things that have evolved SPECIFICALLY by those challenging the status quo"

It seems to be a common conservative trick at the moment to ignore the broader benefits of something and highlight on the tiny pointy end which accounts for 1% of the reason for a thing. It seems to have started with all that stupid GamerGate bulls*** and has degenerated into this weird kneejerk reaction where statements like "women should have equal rights to men" get interpreted as "men are evil and should be eradicated". (This is so common I'm wondering if there's some sort of actual playbook somewhere that these people are following which actually includes all the logical fallacies that you should try to use in your argument.)

Sure, there are extremist feminists that probably say things along those lines. But framing the whole debate about equality in terms of those kinds of extremist positions is not helpful but it's what everyone wants to do because it makes for great clicks and violent discussions.

Some political correctness is a good thing. Some white guilt is a good thing. Pretending that these are real problems that are affecting billions of people though? I cannot take it seriously.

Also, trying to frame my conversation by posting that article as an example of something I would support is pretty low.

Some political correctness is a good thing. Some white guilt is a good thing. Pretending that these are real problems that are affecting billions of people though? I cannot take it seriously.

Also, trying to frame my conversation by posting that article as an example of something I would support is pretty low.

You can call it low if you like, but you're the one who said they aren't big problems, and are confined to twitter.

I'd say a 16 year suppression of organised child rape gangs is a pretty f*****g big problem. That isn't on twitter. And its being resolved right now. You might say a similar issue has got Cardinal Pell in a bit of hotwater.

It doesn't follow that you support child rape, nor did I suggest you did. But if you're eager strawman yourself, go right ahead.

It can't really be cherry picking if the prime minister, an independent report and the chief prosecutor of the opp all described it as a *systematic* politically correct culture that lead to problem.

Last I heard *systematic* is the opposite of *cherry picking*. PC culture has it's issues, and has lead to catastrophic failures such as the one detailed. If you go to the bottom you can find similar gangs to rotherham in at least seven other UK cities. All affected by more or less the same issue.

I'm happy to accept that a conservative demanding the status quo be challenged is jarring. But even a broken clock is still right twice a day.

If PC was nothing more and nothing less than being nice to each other there wouldn't be a problem. Seems like if it can lead to suppression of organised child rape, it could be worth taking a second look.

Could aliens have more than male and female? Could they have like 5 types? Maybe it's 8?

What is it you guys are declaring you believe ?

That choosing how to live your own life is the only true freedom people have, and getting in the way of that is wrong.

What else is there to care about?

One thing I have learned is that I can say someone has mental issues if I disagree with them. Like Nerf does.

This is generally what both sides seem to do.
http://i.imgur.com/5tBmgMS.jpg

I found an article in Scientific American site about trans brains. Interesting read. Here are some excerpts.

Some children insist, from the moment they can speak, that they are not the gender indicated by their biological sex. So where does this knowledge reside? And is it possible to discern a genetic or anatomical basis for transgender identity? Exploration of these questions is relatively new, but there is a bit of evidence for a genetic basis.

Male and female brains are, on average, slightly different in structure, although there is tremendous individual variability. Several studies have looked for signs that transgender people have brains more similar to their experienced gender.

Link - http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/is-there-something-unique-about-the-transgender-brain/


If there is a biological reasons for transgender stuff, then it makes a lot more sense and gives some credibility. It probably isn't just some Tumblr fanfiction fantasy bulls***. Gender fluidity and kin is another matter.

That choosing how to live your own life is the only true freedom people have, and getting in the way of that is wrong.

nice wibble-wobble
Tolerating a delusion does not make it real
Now what is the evidence that convinces you Women are living in Mens bodies ?

I dont care if Men want to live as Women but I draw the line at declaring they are Women and deserving of all the privileges afforded to Biological Women.

Brain Scans ? lol ?
http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn28582-scans-prove-theres-no-such-thing-as-a-male-or-female-brain/




last edited by FaceMan at 23:06:28 26/Aug/16

I can say someone has mental issues if I disagree with them.

Nope, only when they show the severe learning disability that infi and faceman have, where they shutdown and ignore when new information is presented, or accuse conspiracies.

Somebody disagreed with me on what transgender means, and it turns out they were right, and I changed my position.

I didn't go down the hole of ridiculousness that faceman and infi are and should not be encouraged to as if it's a sane acceptable adult behaviour. Notice how he's now pretending as if the definition was never given, and just keeps on harping in pretend ignorance, layering on the conspiracies between aliens, linguists, scientists, etc, rather than ever learn what he doesn't want to, all to suit an agenda on a weird side issue which just happens to be associated with the political partisanship he has chosen. He is, by just about any measure I can think of, sick, and should not be encouraged as if he's sane or this s*** is respectable. He needs to be made to understand that he has to seek help, not talked to as if he's a clear-thinking or honest adult, which just encourages his problem.

Idiot.

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=define%3A%20gender

gender != sex

what transgender means, and it turns out they were right, and I changed my position.

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=define%3A%20gender

^ I'd love to know when your mind broke.

Faceman, 100% serious here, you badly need to go see mental health professionals, now. You don't grasp the extent of how messed up you've become, nor that your thoughts are predictably just falling to soapboxing about conspiracies regardless of what anybody says to you.

This is pretty good.

First QGL thread I've read in years.
Wew, what a doozy.

Hope Ein is doing well.
If 4chan is anything to go by, Traps are like now a thing.

wraps it all up perfectly.

I agree!

(We're talking about the dangerous spread of hipsterism, right? You know, the thing that is vastly more in-your-face IRL than the deadly deadly threat of people who are claiming to be some other gender. I just returned home from drinking in Shoreditch which is apparently the hipster capital of London where I was confronted with many scary lumberjack shirts. )

Thanks for the tips, I'll check those places out - I've actually been to Breakfast Club but not through the fridge door, though I have seen people go in there :)

The hipsters seem to have brought a wave of good craft beer in the pubs nearby now so there are lots of good options for me (I live in Whitechapel so just south of Shoreditch)

Channel 9 News is reporting a 4 yrold is "transitioning"
4 yrolds understand that they can become the opposing Sex ?

Child psychologist Michael Carr-Gregg said it was important people recognise the difference between "dress ups" and transgender children who were often bullied and suffered high suicide rates later in life because they were forced to live in denial. "There is a huge difference between dress-ups and a child believing with every fibre of their being they are in the wrong body," he told the Daily Telegraph

http://www.9news.com.au/health/2016/09/01/02/52/four-year-old-child-youngest-nsw-transitioning-gender-preschool-safe-schools#zJpfhczltLtXE44V.99

What is this huge difference ?
The 4 yrold Child believes its real ?

Im sure Homeopathy could fix this.