Full body scanners coming to Australian airports
From The ABC:
The Federal Government will introduce legislation this week so the technology can be rolled out in all of Australia's international airports.Apparently there is no opt out for a manual pat down. Even in the USA you can get a pat down. |
01:28pm 07/02/12 Permalink
Wait, isn't this universally regarded as a terrible idea in the US? I wonder who makes these things and how much they have spent on greasing palms to get them implemented.
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01:32pm 07/02/12 Permalink
I personally couldn't care if they want to see my penis in x-ray 3D vision so be it, but what's stopping some fat troll picking out hot sexy ladies for a 'full body scan'?
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01:34pm 07/02/12 Permalink
It's a good idea. The only people who will whinge about this are women. Unless you're an alien who doesn't look human then who gives a s***? Everyone looks the same naked, unless you're a big fat pig.
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01:37pm 07/02/12 Permalink
Apparently the scanner doesn't display the naked image to anyone, it is programmed to detect the presence of certain items in the xray, and simply indicates this on a cartoon man, regardless of your actually shape/size.
Sounds like something that probably wouldn't work at all a lot of the time anyway. It's just there for show. |
01:41pm 07/02/12 Permalink
sounds like a crock of s***. What sort of xray are they using? ones that the operators stand behind a 3inch piece of led sheeting and say 'you'll be fine mate, just hold on to your nuts"
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01:44pm 07/02/12 Permalink
Aaron I will watch your forum career with great interest.
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01:50pm 07/02/12 Permalink
LOL
As if being x-rayed is gonna hurt you. Are you a terrorist? |
01:51pm 07/02/12 Permalink
Aaron I will watch your forum career with great interest. Forum career? Im confused? what does that mean? LOL Xrays are bad for you, that is why the doctor will stand in another room or behind a screen when they xray you. ever broken a bone? last edited by trog at 13:56:44 07/Feb/12 |
01:55pm 07/02/12 Permalink
Xrays are bad for you, that is why the doctor will stand in another room or behind a screen when they xray you. ever broken a bone? That's because the Doctor might do it 100 times a day... |
01:57pm 07/02/12 Permalink
Xrays are bad for you, that is why the doctor will stand in another room or behind a screen when they xray you. ever broken a bone?These scanners that are being used in Australia are not x-ray scanners; they are a 'new' class of device called millimeter wave scanners. They are "safe" compared to x-rays (i.e., noone has demonstrated that they cause harm, but they have not been in service long). |
01:59pm 07/02/12 Permalink
The only reason they stand in another room is because they're all laughing at you because you think it's serious. People survived Nazi death camps and you're whinging about walking thru a scanner.
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02:01pm 07/02/12 Permalink
Guess they will just wait until a frenzy of infertility, where no one can breed because their junk has been cooked, breaks out and then blame it on something else
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02:01pm 07/02/12 Permalink
When was the last time an incident occurred at said airports because the current security measures were insufficient?
I don't like new invasive security measures being introduced if the current ones are already effective. |
02:10pm 07/02/12 Permalink
I dont like how every single time i go there i have been 'randomly' selected for either an explosives test or drugs.
Doesnt seem to random to me if its everytime you walk in the place.... |
02:12pm 07/02/12 Permalink
Sc00bs. Are you an Arab or a terrorist? That might be why.
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02:14pm 07/02/12 Permalink
I get that too, never done a single trip without being pulled out of the pack for extra searching.
Doesn't bother me though, I assume they're just profiling people like police do and it's not random... I'm young, look like a grot, act shifty in airports. |
02:16pm 07/02/12 Permalink
I don't like new invasive security measures being introduced if the current ones are already effective. Its about prevention not about thinking everything is ok with the current procedures. I guess it's the concept that if you do enforce these rules its a deterant more than anything else right? Everytime I have flown in the last year (3-4 times?) I have been selected for a "random" explosive materials swipe. Doesn't bother me, I know they have a checklist where they have to meet a quota of checks each day. They are keeping us safe. |
02:18pm 07/02/12 Permalink
white and madc*** looking rev.
Last time i went the machine said positive, so i had to go in for further searching and interrogations... to which another reading said positive, then they did a third and final which was negative. All of this cost me 45min of my life and then in return i got a "have a nice day sir" |
02:22pm 07/02/12 Permalink
Its about prevention not about thinking everything is ok with the current procedures. I guess it's the concept that if you do enforce these rules its a deterant more than anything else right?I have a problem with that. You have to draw the line somewhere, I draw the line where if there are no incidents occurring with the current security procedures then it doesn't warrant an extra invasion of privacy. Now if there are incidents occurring at these airports, I'm all for it... I just don't think that's the case. When was the last time a person tried to subvert the security measures at Brisbane airport with the intention of causing serious harm (knive/gun/bomb etc)? Genuine question. |
02:28pm 07/02/12 Permalink
I thought they already had this? I only went through once, but had had to take something or other out of my pockets, so I thought that they could see through.
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02:40pm 07/02/12 Permalink
My dad got hit up once, showed up traces of Heroin/Cocaine on his back pack. The same back pack he takes to work as an Ambulance officer, he just showed them his ID and off he went.
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02:43pm 07/02/12 Permalink
Gutsy trog, I'm strongly against them but I wouldn't be opting out in a US airport because of their powers if they wanted to be pricks.
Same goes with US cops, wouldn't mess with them. /seen too many episodes of US law enforcement/border security type shows. |
02:49pm 07/02/12 Permalink
my objection is that there is no opt out (unless there is a medical reason)
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02:50pm 07/02/12 Permalink
I don't get why people won't walk thru these things. There are worse things in the world that are killing you than walking thru an x-ray machine.
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02:55pm 07/02/12 Permalink
Wasn't there an article about how pointless airport security is becoming as dirty mulims can just drive a van full of fertiliser into the middle of town and blow the crap out of the CBD to cause more injury/death & damage.
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02:58pm 07/02/12 Permalink
I don't get why people won't walk thru these things. There are worse things in the world that are killing you than walking thru an x-ray machine. i guess it is like getting nude, let zapped with radiation that has some doubt over health, but it is assured that there is no health effects long term or short, at least if you didn't like mobiles you could not use them, (there were people that didn't fly on concorde because of higher radiation levels) |
03:09pm 07/02/12 Permalink
Haven't read but was said on radio other day the new X-rays will show you as a stick figure(total recall anyone?)
I'm not looking forward to getting groped by TSA when I go to Hawaii in may. |
03:10pm 07/02/12 Permalink
Wait, isn't this universally regarded as a terrible idea in the US? I wonder who makes these things and how much they have spent on greasing palms to get them implemented.same company that provided them to the USA apparently. Doesn't bother me, I know they have a checklist where they have to meet a quota of checks each day. They are keeping us safe. how do we feel about these getting introduced to train stations or major bus terminals? I was just like you until i turned up positive for urea(explosives), that cost me a good 20min of my life as well as a particularly akward conversation that went along the lines of "wouldn't pissing on my shoes return a positive result?" So now when i'm "randomly selected" i make sure to be as painful and slow as possible and to take as much of their time to make sure i'm getting my monies worth of security attention. |
03:13pm 07/02/12 Permalink
why the hell would you have elevated levels of urea on you (enough to trigger the scanners at least)
because i can waste the time, i have tried a few things (other than out and out making a bomb) and i've not once set it off hell even two days after the shooting range and the GSR levels are too low to set the machine off |
03:17pm 07/02/12 Permalink
Yeah those millimeter wave scanners dont sound bad at all...
Alexandrov and co have created a model to investigate how THz fields interact with double-stranded DNA and what they've found is remarkable. They say that although the forces generated are tiny, resonant effects allow THz waves to unzip double-stranded DNA, creating bubbles in the double strand that could significantly interfere with processes such as gene expression and DNA replication |
03:40pm 07/02/12 Permalink
The millimetre-wave body scanners are perfectly safe and one body scan is comparable to passive exposure to a mobile phone used several metres away," Mr Albanese said in a statement. What was that ? What type of exposure are people who have the mobile phone next to their head copping ? This an Outrage. Im not going to be scanned and Id be keen to see Albanese's evidence for his safety claim, lets see him go though one ten times in a row to prove they are safe. Looks like this is headed to Court. Pretty soon they'll be doing cavity searches on Air Travellers. |
03:48pm 07/02/12 Permalink
i have issues with these scanners because both my missus and i work in hospitals and we get enough radiation there. my missus is also a radiographer.
basically you have untrained tossers dragged off the street operating these machines that generate radiation. no training, no understanding of radiation physics, no understanding of the physiological effects of radiation, no official body monitoring the doses that people receive from these machines and you can't decline the scan. anyone who thinks this is a good idea is a f***tard of monumental proportions who has no idea of the potential health risks. this is a seriously flawed approach to airport security and the government needs a lobotomy for forcing it on everyone. |
03:50pm 07/02/12 Permalink
Yes and how often do you break a bone? Some people catch flights every few days or even once a week. being xrayed once per week over your life cannot be good for you. I've had a bad hip all my life (see Perthes Disease/Syndrome) and have had WAY more x-rays than flights. I'm fine. The only reason they use the protection is because they're doing scans every 30 minutes every day. |
03:52pm 07/02/12 Permalink
Yeah those millimeter wave scanners dont sound bad at all...Yeh its weird, Wikipedia says millimeter wave scanners are different to terahertz scanners and they emit completely different wavelengths of radiation, but then it has that quote you pasted in the millimeter wave section :|Alexandrov and co have created a model to investigate how THz fields interact with double-stranded DNA and what they've found is remarkable. They say that although the forces generated are tiny, resonant effects allow THz waves to unzip double-stranded DNA, creating bubbles in the double strand that could significantly interfere with processes such as gene expression and DNA replication |
04:13pm 07/02/12 Permalink
Why does Aaron keep getting edited by trog? Is his english retarded?
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04:33pm 07/02/12 Permalink
Scoobs.. i'm in the same boat. I got flagged by one of the sniffer dogs that couldn't make it's mind up a couple of years ago. Bags got searched by federal police and asked me some questions.. everything came back negative and they let me go.
Came back to Aus last xmas and the customs guy came straight up to me and circled "carrying drugs" on the arrival card so I had to get my bag searched again. Pain in the ass - but they did rush me through it a bit faster. Pretty sure i'm gonna get marked every time / waste 45 minutes because of that dog >_< |
06:44pm 07/02/12 Permalink
http://www.ozvisathai.com/images/Australian_arrival_card_english.jpg The box at the top right is what i meant Trog. I had ticked "No" and he came and circled "Yes". He did have a quick chat with me, asking if it was my first time in Thailand etc. I think just because i've been marked before, i'm getting pulled up 'just cos' now. *edit* On second thoughts it could be because alot of people bring steriods back from Thailand too? I'm not huge but im fit :) |
08:10pm 07/02/12 Permalink
Scoobs.. i'm in the same boat. I got flagged by one of the sniffer dogs that couldn't make it's mind up a couple of years ago. Bags got searched by federal police and asked me some questions.. everything came back negative and they let me go. Would be kind of funny if you were actually smuggling drugs the second time too. Like instantly f***ed over. |
08:25pm 07/02/12 Permalink
Can't believe anyone would think a pat down is less invasive than walking through a scanner and some dude seeing a weird blobish outline of your junk in black and white. Getting through security would be a f*****g nightmare if everyone wanted a pat down, it's what they do flying domestically in India and you have to queue up again to get through a security check before walking out onto the tarmic to board.
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08:58pm 07/02/12 Permalink
I have no issue with this.
Also, I'm happy to get patted down as much as they want as long as its by a nice looking bird :p |
09:41pm 07/02/12 Permalink
I tell you what, TSA were pretty nice...actually nicer then Australian customs when I got home. I went through the body scanner they we're like "wtf is that" then I had a fun discussion about the metal bar in my chest and on my way I went.
For me I don't travel often enough to give a s*** about these scanners. |
10:33pm 07/02/12 Permalink
Doesn't bother me one bit. I'll shake it for them in there.
ps, Ive come up positive for explosive once too. It was up in the Whitsundays, so they were all "lol, sunscreen bro?" |
10:37pm 07/02/12 Permalink
10:49pm 07/02/12 Permalink
I have no issue with this. Wait till you have to go through them to get on a Bus or into a Shop. Whatever happened to 'grounds for suspicion' ? Good Free Men should not be treated like Criminals. The time to stand up is now. |
11:24pm 07/02/12 Permalink
The time to stand up is now. Or bend over as the case may be. |
11:36pm 07/02/12 Permalink
Aaron if you're that concerned about the tiny amount of radiation coming from a scan why are you flying often? A flight from NYC > LA exposes you to about double the radiation of a full chest x-ray. source
According to this article millimetre wave scanners don't even produce ionizing radiation, and the other type; backscatter x-ray scanners that they use in the US expose you to about 0.1 microsievert of radiation. Meaning it would take 1000 scans to be the same as a chest x-ray, or 2000 scans to be the same as a flight from New York to Los Angeles. |
11:37pm 07/02/12 Permalink
Interesting. I've flown a lot over the past 6 years, all over Europe, bits of Asia and the United States. By far the most rude and oppressive customs people/airport staff I've ever encountered were at Brisbane airport. I'm not fussed about the full body scanners, if there's no serious ill health effects which should be unequivocally confirmed - though it's hard to believe they'd be comissioned to the public if there were. Also don’t mind the body pats, would prefer if it could be the females giving the pat down though! |
01:40am 08/02/12 Permalink
Why are people saying they take issue with not having the option to opt out? doesn't that kind of make it useless?
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05:56am 08/02/12 Permalink
Why are people saying they take issue with not having the option to opt out? doesn't that kind of make it useless? because under the US system if you opt out they perform a manual pat down which accomplishes the same thing?.. |
08:04am 08/02/12 Permalink
Pirate Party represents:
"Why has the public once again been not consulted by this Government when intending to implement legislation that will be yet another attack on our civil liberties? We have repeatedly seen plans and schemes negotiated in secrecy – ACTA, as a recent example – that threaten our rights, and have had no chance to raise our concerns until it is too late," Molloy continued. "Why would Australia adopt such a scheme given that cities such as Hamburg have rejected the system as unworkable? They are playing on fears to take away our civil liberties." |
12:15pm 08/02/12 Permalink
You know if the option to vote for the pirate party comes up, I'll take it.
F***it, I'll even dress up like a pirate when I go to vote, might as well have fun with it. |
01:39pm 08/02/12 Permalink
I find the take on Australian body scanners interesting cause in the trial you had to 'consent' and sign away to actually participate. Someone mentioned the book years earlier on the forum "The Age of Consent" by George Monbiont. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Monbiot and how we're seeing this wonderful signing that signature of everything.
Other thoughts: http://www.technologyreview.com/blog/arxiv/24331/ - How Terahertz Waves Tear Apart DNA A new model of the way the THz waves interact with DNA explains how the damage is done and why evidence has been so hard to gather. (So we would need a long term study on this -- funny how they like to speedily implement these things isn't it.) http://www.forbes.com/sites/daviddisalvo/2011/11/15/europe-bans-airport-body-scanners-over-health-and-safety-concerns/ - Interestingly enough the scanners banned in Europe. On the bright hand side people have found other creative ways to go through the TSA security station: http://youtu.be/ASYLnhTaduI - Man goes through in his swimming togs. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YHd3i7ZA2uU - Girl goes through scanner in bikini. But if that is what it takes to make security procedures look ridiculous. There you go. |
12:30am 09/02/12 Permalink
