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Can I purchase 100 year lease of some phrase in google advertising?
imitation
Brisbane, Queensland
3716 posts
I don't know if anyone here has bought any google advertising but how do the contracts work? can I purchse the rights to some phrase exclusively for a period of time? IE somewhat searches pie and every time I come up as top spot in google ads www.pie.com

edit: for my mind this will be the new domain name squatting
08:52pm 15/04/10 Permalink
system
Internet
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08:52pm 15/04/10 Permalink
thermite
Brisbane, Queensland
4843 posts
No I don't think so. From what I've seen with client websites is that you put credit into your adwords account. You set it up to target some keywords, google continually rates the relevance and quality of your website to decide how often to show your ad (and with most words there are a lot of competitor sites), and it eats your credit when people click on the ad. The worse your site's quality score is the more money you lose until the credit is all gone, and then it won't show your ad anymore.
09:01pm 15/04/10 Permalink
imitation
Brisbane, Queensland
3717 posts
that's a really fair way of doing it
09:11pm 15/04/10 Permalink
iWhoop
Brisbane, Queensland
15990 posts
No I don't think so. From what I've seen with client websites is that you put credit into your adwords account. You set it up to target some keywords, google continually rates the relevance and quality of your website to decide how often to show your ad (and with most words there are a lot of competitor sites), and it eats your credit when people click on the ad. The worse your site's quality score is the more money you lose until the credit is all gone, and then it won't show your ad anymore.

So if google decides your site is s***, they take more money from you for every click and if they think your site is the most awesome thing in the 'verse they take less per click? That sounds dumb or am I misunderstanding what you're saying?
09:14pm 15/04/10 Permalink
thermite
Brisbane, Queensland
4845 posts
Isn't that the same thing?
09:23pm 15/04/10 Permalink
iWhoop
Brisbane, Queensland
15991 posts
Yeah I think I worded it wrong, edited to make more sense.
09:47pm 15/04/10 Permalink
TicMan
Melbourne, Victoria
5808 posts
They also base that on impression & CTR.. if your ad shows 1,000,000,000,000 times and only gets 1 click then it's clear your ad is s*** and will stop being displayed.
09:48pm 15/04/10 Permalink
thermite
Brisbane, Queensland
4848 posts
Google's purpose is to give searchers what they want, so I guess they discourage dodgy sites / dodgy ads, or basically punish them with higher advertising rates and lower organic results placement.
10:37pm 15/04/10 Permalink
trog
AGN Admin
Brisbane, Queensland
30290 posts
You set it up to target some keywords, google continually rates the relevance and quality of your website to decide how often to show your ad
I have been messing with adwords a bit recently and I'm not sure this is true. I think they'll happily keep showing your ad as long as a) you're bidding the correct amount per ad and b) your keywords are relevant to the search queries/content network pages.

I am not sure about that though, but I don't think site quality factors into it at all (I don't see why they would either from a biz perspective; generally they're happy to take anyone's money, which is why there's so many truly terrible and useless google ads)
10:37pm 15/04/10 Permalink
thermite
Brisbane, Queensland
4849 posts
I may have got mixed up a bit, but there is something called a quality score:
Quality Score for Google and the Search Network is a dynamic metric assigned to each of your keywords. It's calculated using a variety of factors and measures how relevant your keyword is to your ad group and to a user's search query. The higher a keyword's Quality Score, the lower its cost-per-clicks (CPCs) and the better its ad position.

http://adwords.google.com/support/aw/bin/answer.py?hl=en&answer=21388
http://adwords.google.com/support/aw/bin/answer.py?hl=en&answer=10215
http://www.searchenginejournal.com/troubleshooting-the-google-landing-page-quality-score/5412/

If your Quality Score is low, you may be using keywords, ads, or landing pages that aren't as targeted or relevant as they could be.


http://adwords.google.com/support/aw/bin/answer.py?hl=en&answer=50688

last edited by thermite at 22:49:15 15/Apr/10
10:43pm 15/04/10 Permalink
mongie
Brisbane, Queensland
7186 posts
So basically, if you're advertising for relevant searches, and actually possibly being helpful to people, you get charged less.

If you're trying to advertise Viagra when people search for Child Care, you're going to get charged an assload.
10:52pm 15/04/10 Permalink
konstie
Melbourne, Victoria
935 posts
google watch everything you do.
11:29pm 15/04/10 Permalink
Ross
Brisbane, Queensland
2224 posts
10 years ago or whatever it was when I first used adwords google would block your add if you did not reach a 5% CTR. It made it very f*****g annoying if you were trying to get value from your clicks by making your ad highly targeted. It is a stupid money grubbing way to do it (very un-google like) and I have no idea if they have changed it since.

Adwords is basically like any other pay per click search engine were you bid on a term and your bid directly relates to the order in which your ad is displayed on the page. This is another reason low bidders get f***ed on 5% CTR.

They pansy their market up by putting in a few stupid rules were you can actually over take a higher bidder than yourself if your CTR is higher than theirs. Again using CTR as its main measure of relevance (stupid). You control your expenditure by setting daily limits on clicks but you also have to put in a bid range instead of just a flat cost / click. This is meant to save you money by only outbidding the top result as much as you have to but on a competitive word you always pay full price.

The only value we found in their market was by negotiating a mass keyword buy on terms which currently had no bids and a very low volume of searches. You could target your ad as much as you like and they would not block for being under 5% CTR.
11:41pm 15/04/10 Permalink
iWhoop
Brisbane, Queensland
15992 posts
Google's purpose is to give searchers what they want, so I guess they discourage dodgy sites / dodgy ads, or basically punish them with higher advertising rates and lower organic results placement.

But they don't. Half the s*** I've searched for lately have returned mostly links to other search engines with results on the same search. Some of the stuff I go looking for brings up mostly online price comparison websites if it's a physical product, the manufacturers site is maybe half way down the page (I have 100 results per page) or at worst nowhere in sight.
12:03am 16/04/10 Permalink
Superform
Netherlands
6126 posts
the best way to guarantee usage of a key word is to trademark it..

i know for a fact that we dont let anyone use the word heineken on adwords with out approval
03:40am 16/04/10 Permalink
imitation
Brisbane, Queensland
3722 posts
But they don't. Half the s*** I've searched for lately have returned mostly links to other search engines with results on the same search. Some of the stuff I go looking for brings up mostly online price comparison websites if it's a physical product, the manufacturers site is maybe half way down the page (I have 100 results per page) or at worst nowhere in sight.

This is the truth, I'm not even sure why I bother with google half the time I use it is garbage.
03:55am 16/04/10 Permalink
skythra
Brisbane, Queensland
2219 posts
My understanding is they also consider how popular your site is off the site itself. That is, how much do people talk about your site (forum posts etc which directly link back to your site) or other web sites which partner and link to your sites and things like that.

I don't know really, I think other bits have been suggested.

I know there are services which say "Top of google for a week" and things like this, but my understanding of that was by doing that you're actually likely to have your listing removed from google completely if they find that your hits have all been fake.
04:59am 16/04/10 Permalink
trog
AGN Admin
Brisbane, Queensland
30293 posts
10 years ago or whatever it was when I first used adwords google would block your add if you did not reach a 5% CTR.
Yeh I think they have changed that; most of the words I have in atm are < 1% CTR and they are still happily and actively being served.
The only value we found in their market was by negotiating a mass keyword buy on terms which currently had no bids and a very low volume of searches. You could target your ad as much as you like and they would not block for being under 5% CTR.
heh that's good news because that is precisely the strategy that I'm planning to employ for us :)
09:29am 16/04/10 Permalink
trog
AGN Admin
Brisbane, Queensland
30294 posts
My understanding is they also consider how popular your site is off the site itself. That is, how much do people talk about your site (forum posts etc which directly link back to your site) or other web sites which partner and link to your sites and things like that.
As I mentioned above I don't /think/ that is how their adwords stuff works. That is definitely how their SEARCH works but adwords they just take money and serve it based on who is bidding the most and who has the best keywords as they relate to content/searches.
09:31am 16/04/10 Permalink
thermite
Brisbane, Queensland
4850 posts
But they don't. Half the s*** I've searched for lately have returned mostly links to other search engines with results on the same search. Some of the stuff I go looking for brings up mostly online price comparison websites if it's a physical product, the manufacturers site is maybe half way down the page (I have 100 results per page) or at worst nowhere in sight.


Unfortunately those shopping sites are a lot more aggressive with their search engine strategies, basically they spend a lot of time figuring out how google works and trying to beat the manufacturer's site in search results and ad placements. A few times in the past google has improved their algorithms, and sites that don't deserve high placement have dropped very quickly. The complicated thing is that the shopping sites often stay a lot more up-to-date and refresh their content more frequently than the manufacturer's website, and so they legitimately have a claim to be higher in the rankings. Kind of a tough one for Google, I guess.


09:52am 16/04/10 Permalink
Nitro
Gold Coast, Queensland
1891 posts
In a nutshell QS has made it more important to create targeting landing pages for each search term/keyword group. The QS is one factor in how much you pay for a click. They are also starting to integrate things like bounce rate tracking (eg person clicks on ad but then immediately goes back to google without browsing further). The most important thing with Adwords campaigns is to NEVER use broad match keywords or you will get royally f***ed paying for expensive clicks. Also never bid for the top listing, always try to be on the side. Compile massive lists of long tails and send the clicks to targetted pages with the keyword mentioned to improve QS.

If you decide to roll the dice with adwords be wary of what a click can cost. People spend a lot on this s***. I manage a clients campaign spending 20k/month and that's not a lot in this business.

Biggest google cash cow ever.
09:54am 16/04/10 Permalink
TicMan
Melbourne, Victoria
5810 posts
Yeah we spend about $80k/mth in Google and another $20k in Yahoo and we're not even a household name yet!
10:54am 16/04/10 Permalink
trog
AGN Admin
Brisbane, Queensland
30297 posts
80k/month! holy f*** me. how well do you find it works? are you going for conversions ?
11:00am 16/04/10 Permalink
TicMan
Melbourne, Victoria
5813 posts
Works really well, we spent a lot of time tweaking and improving landing pages, forms, etc and have got a conversion rate of around 30% on a good day which is quite high. Mind you we also burnt BUCKET LOADS of cash trying to get it to the performance it is now. Once you have the right pages and keywords in place it then becomes a volume game.. the more money you spend the more money you make. We're one of those businesses that's built on Google AdWords :)

It's fascinating watching how little variation occurs in conversion day after day. Wether it's 1,000 people coming through the site or 10,000 the percentage never seems to change and to see how you can remove or add a field in a form and within half a day you can see if it's made a positive or negative impact. Even placement of images or the wording of text can make a huge difference to your conversion rates.

(ps: require SEM - PM me! :D)
11:14am 16/04/10 Permalink
greazy
Brisbane, Queensland
3283 posts
Ticman what company do you work for?
11:37am 16/04/10 Permalink
TicMan
Melbourne, Victoria
5816 posts
Probably can't say but we do home loan, health insurance and life insurance comparisons .. and it's not iSelect!
11:44am 16/04/10 Permalink
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11:44am 16/04/10 Permalink
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