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Electrical Safety
Timmeh
Brisbane, Queensland
1746 posts
Just though I would point this out.
Don't do your own electrical work, accidents happen, even to the qualified.




"If your in the electrical field you have probably seen this, yes it is old but still relevant"

Always use a Qualified sparky and request to see there license before starting work.
11:07pm 19/01/12 Permalink
system
Internet
--
11:07pm 19/01/12 Permalink
Crakaveli
USA
5988 posts
rubber mats ftw
11:14pm 19/01/12 Permalink
parabol
Brisbane, Queensland
6702 posts
The only thing I hate more than electrocution is f*****g photo-slideshows on youtube with music.
11:44pm 19/01/12 Permalink
teq
Brisbane, Queensland
12313 posts
nah f*** that, it's so hard to get a good sparky to actually show up
anytime I've ever rang one, which has been multiple times over the years, for callouts/upgrades/installs, the only one that ever showed up was a mate from school
I dont know what happens to the rest of them but sometimes they call and say they had another job but other times they just literally never show up or even call to say they wont make it?

i dont understand why everyone thinks electrical work is this mythical skill that only a select few should do
there is a law against doing it yourself but there are plenty of laws we ignore every single day, this one doesn't seem any more important than any of the others that could also potentially kill you

the kind of work you'll do around the house is really not that hard, it's something that is perfectly legal in many other countries and its a skill that can be very useful
like anything, learn how to do it and do it properly
11:58pm 19/01/12 Permalink
parabol
Brisbane, Queensland
6703 posts
i dont understand why everyone thinks electrical work is this mythical skill that only a select few should do
there is a law against doing it yourself but there are plenty of laws we ignore every single day, this one doesn't seem any more important than any of the others that could also potentially kill you

I just came from the hard-drive thread to see this. You're a serious bad-advice panda.

The problem with electrical work is that by nature you're routing currents that have the potential to kill you. If untrained, you won't know the procedures or rules of thumb to avoid a seemingly minor mistake that can land you dead or in the case of bad installation a house/building fire that has the potential to harm -others-.

However I do believe the restrictions for electrical work are too harsh in QLD. You need to do an apprenticeship or similar and clock your time in over years before you can do work yourself.

Whereas realistically I don't see why they can't just require people to take a short hands-on course, which could divide electrical work licenses into categories depending on how serious or risky the work is. I mean at the moment as an electrical engineer, I'm not allowed by law to make a simple step-down power supply using an off-the-shelf transformer and power cable without having to do 3+ years as an electrician's apprentice ...

last edited by parabol at 00:19:36 20/Jan/12
12:10am 20/01/12 Permalink
Pinky
Melbourne, Victoria
12279 posts
Yep, there are standards.

I'm a hobbyist electronics guy, program microcontrollers, use a multimeter, etc. Would back myself to do any electrical work.

My best mate is a sparky. I always get him to do my work. And everytime he does, I learn something new.

Just like everything, there are particular ways to go about doing things and standards that apply - if you're not qualified, you don't know them.
12:15am 20/01/12 Permalink
teq
Brisbane, Queensland
12314 posts
you recommended a drive that was 35% more expensive on the off chance that it might fail?
can you explain why he should tell his mate its going to cost more money than it needs to, because someone on the internet said it had better reviews than a drive that does the exact same thing for 35% less
I didn't even bother replying in there because i just dont care that much

there are plenty of countries, first world countries, where doing your own electrical work is perfectly legal.
When done correctly, there is no more risk of being electrocuted than there is risk of having the deck you constructed yourself fall and kill people

it's basically like they've said "well f*** it, electrical work is too hard to explain to people so lets just ban it, make it really hard for people to get a license to do it legally"
Then they complain when there is a lack of qualified sparkies?

instead of just flat out banning it the government could have just laid out detailed building regulations that specify all the regulations with regards to safe wiring, but no thats too hard so just ban it.
you know .. like a deck you can legally build yourself as long as you follow government specified minimums/standards.

you think I'm a 'bad advice panda' and I think you're a sook
boo hoo
12:21am 20/01/12 Permalink
Captain Lateral
Brisbane, Queensland
4310 posts
Whereas realistically I don't see why they can't just require people to take a short hands-on course, which could divide electrical work licenses into categories depending on how serious or risky the work is. I mean at the moment as an electrical engineer, I'm not allowed by law to make a simple step-down power supply using an off-the-shelf transformer and power cable without having to do 3+ years as an electrician's apprentice


as an electrical engineer, you're over qualified to handle a simple stepdown cotroller.

that being said, it was interesting going through tafe about this topic. we went through an entire lesson listenting to the ways people had been electrocuted the year before in australia.

there was a lot of stuff that was obvious, like the guy who died from trying to repair an extension cable while it was plugged in. but a lot of stuff scared me, there was one woman who was just showering, and because the person who had installed the switches years ago didn't do it properly, the woman ended up getting electrocuted and died because the shielding around the electrical cable was too short for the plug it was in, it shorted out against the metal bathtub.

it makes me concerned about me and my family living here considering the owner is happy to get his son to do all the wiring around the joint, and we've already had smoke appear from one of the power sockets.

*continues saving until i can get the f*** outta here*
01:15am 20/01/12 Permalink
sCOOBY
Brisbane, Queensland
4413 posts
phwoar scary. good he recovered

if only they had the:
07:32am 20/01/12 Permalink
spoon
Brisbane, Queensland
464 posts
We had a f*** off huge contactor blow at work the other week, the sparky was lucky he wasn't standing in front of it.

Having said that it was for a motor the size of a small car and it didn't have a soft start system installed luls.

Sparkies who do Industrial work I would say are at a higher risk of injury than wiring lights in a house. I don't have kids or anything but if I failed to pick up on a manufacturing fault of an electrical part or had a brainfart and wired something incorrectly which caused my house to burn down and in turn cost the lives of a potential wife/kid combo I'd want to hang myself.

I'm a maintenance fitter so we work in with the maintenance sparkies and while I could save 20mins by wiring something myself I'd still rather have a sparkie do it.
09:19am 20/01/12 Permalink
Reverend Evil™
Wynnum, Queensland
19714 posts
Few of those shots he sorta looked like Darth Vadar at the end of Return of the Jedi without his mask on.
09:25am 20/01/12 Permalink
Eorl
Brisbane, Queensland
4966 posts
Scooby that's amazing. If only we were allowed to play around with stem cells without fear of people hating, we could have cured a whole heap of things.
09:34am 20/01/12 Permalink
m3nt4l
Brisbane, Queensland
2056 posts
If only we were allowed to play around with stem cells without fear of people hating, we could have cured a whole heap of things.


http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn8164-two-ethical-ways-to-harvest-stem-cells.html

"It means we overcome the key pro-life objection, that you must destroy life to save life," says Lanza.
10:03am 20/01/12 Permalink
Timmeh
Brisbane, Queensland
1750 posts
The problem with electricity is you cant see it, smell it or hear it, but when you touch it you know.

50v rms AC (120v DC ripple free) is enough to start fibrillation, as you sit there you have 230/240V around your house or 415v for those on 3 phase. Now think how many cracked GPOs or Light switches you have.


Alot of our work is theory based, which for the most part is logic based theory.
Cable separation to avoid induced voltage etc, with out knowing the fundamental basics you really have nfi what your doing.
Its a lot more then connecting 3 wires.
06:31pm 20/01/12 Permalink
Denominator
Brisbane, Queensland
910 posts
I mean at the moment as an electrical engineer, I'm not allowed by law to make a simple step-down power supply using an off-the-shelf transformer and power cable without having to do 3+ years as an electrician's apprentice ...


If you are a real electrical engineer why can't you do that work. You don't need a license to do what you are describing. Most people use word of mouth for knowing things but I suggest you try reading the law with the attitude I can do this because.

O and looking at the photos a rubber mat would not have done s*** to protect him from the accident as it looks like a tool malfunction or operator error


it makes me concerned about me and my family living here considering the owner is happy to get his son to do all the wiring around the joint, and we've already had smoke appear from one of the power sockets.


Can you pm me your landlords details so I can have the ESO check it out. (sorry but as an Electrician if I hear of any infringement I have to pass it on by law)

last edited by Denominator at 18:55:09 20/Jan/12
06:53pm 20/01/12 Permalink
Sc00bs
Brisbane, Queensland
8531 posts
^ lol
06:56pm 20/01/12 Permalink
Timmeh
Brisbane, Queensland
1752 posts
Can you pm me your landlords details so I can have the ESO check it out. (sorry but as an Electrician if I hear of any infringement I have to pass it on by law)last edited by Denominator at 18:55:09 20/Jan/12

Dont play the dog card.
07:02pm 20/01/12 Permalink
paveway
Brisbane, Queensland
16121 posts
so the moral of the video is you will shoot out the other side looking fine with a hawt missus ?
07:05pm 20/01/12 Permalink
Timmeh
Brisbane, Queensland
1753 posts
so the moral of the video is you will shoot out the other side looking fine with a hawt missus ?

spot on,
07:07pm 20/01/12 Permalink
teq
Brisbane, Queensland
12318 posts
sorry but as an Electrician if I hear of any infringement I have to pass it on by law


http://www.tacomaworld.com/gallery/data/500/demotivational-posters-come-at-me-bro.jpg
07:18pm 20/01/12 Permalink
deadlyf
Queensland
2368 posts
I wonder how many people happy to do their own electrical work are happy to buy a house from someone who has done their own electrical work?

I was at a place the other day that a girl had recently bought and was renovating and it was costing her a fortune to correct all of the amateur wiring that the last owner had done. Power points on light circuits, earths used as switch wires, speaker cable wiring up lights.

A lady down the street had her frying pan blow up and got burns all up her arm because some teq like hero at one time decided to wire up his own outdoor power point and when he couldn't get it to work he decided to take the circuit that he had connected into, off the safety switch (the one in the kitchen that the frying pan was hooked into). But hey he probably couldn't get an electrician to show up at the arbitrary times that were convenient to him or thought that a sparky's charge too much so it's not really his fault.

The funny thing is, if an electrician had done that they would take away his license and probably put him up on criminal charges but nothing will happen to the guy who wired it illegally. You do your own phone and you get a $1000 fine, you do your own electrical and they ask you nicely to not do that.
07:20pm 20/01/12 Permalink
Sc00bs
Brisbane, Queensland
8532 posts
haha teq
07:21pm 20/01/12 Permalink
parabol
Brisbane, Queensland
6707 posts
If you are a real electrical engineer why can't you do that work. You don't need a license to do what you are describing

Yes I do. No mains work allowed by law, look it up. There are minor exceptions, like if I am installing specific telecoms equipment and specifically for work. None of the exceptions apply for home or hobbyist work.

last edited by parabol at 19:32:03 20/Jan/12
07:29pm 20/01/12 Permalink
Timmeh
Brisbane, Queensland
1754 posts
Yes I do. No mains work allowed by law, look it up. There are minor exceptions, like if I am installing specific telecoms equipment and specifically for work. None of the exceptions apply for home or hobbyist work.last edited by parabol at 19:32:03 20/Jan/12

Correct.
The same for an EFM.
Can work on 30v upwards but needs separate license (ACA) for 30v and below.

If your a license EFM, but don't have your contractors license you can perform work at for family and yourself with out financial gain.
07:47pm 20/01/12 Permalink
Denominator
Brisbane, Queensland
911 posts
parabol the electrical safety act only covers fixed wiring so you don't need a license to do any work after it comes out of the mains power point.
07:47pm 20/01/12 Permalink
parabol
Brisbane, Queensland
6708 posts
parabol the electrical safety act only covers fixed wiring so you don't need a license to do any work after it comes out of the mains power point.

Do you have an exact source on that? Reading the Electrical act it talks heaps about electrical equipment and parts (not just fixed wiring, etc), but it's hard to decode all of the legal jargon.

http://www.legislation.qld.gov.au/LEGISLTN/CURRENT/E/ElectricalSR02.pdf
08:23pm 20/01/12 Permalink
BassMan
Brisbane, Queensland
1508 posts
teq -

# What's the difference between the neutral & earth conductors?
# What's a MEN link?

Without even watching the Op's video, I can tell from the still it's arc flash. The human body doesn't handle plasma too well, hence the reason we don't really switch anything standing in front of live switchgear anymore.

Unlike the old days, we tend not to do any live work (exception of ELV & EHV where the boys wear the steel thread suits aka 'bird on a wire').

last edited by BassMan at 21:00:18 20/Jan/12
08:53pm 20/01/12 Permalink
Timmeh
Brisbane, Queensland
1755 posts
teq -

# What's the difference between the neutral & earth conductors?
# What's a MEN link?

Without even watching the Op's video, I can tell from the still it's arc flash. The human body doesn't handle plasma too well, hence the reason we don't really switch anything standing in front of live switchgear anymore.

Unlike the old days, we tend not to do any live work (exception of ELV & EHV where the boys wear the steal thread suits aka 'bird on a wire').

Old days of testing if its live with the back of your hand.
08:55pm 20/01/12 Permalink
Denominator
Brisbane, Queensland
912 posts
Ok here we go

Parabol

What is electrical work? hint http://www.legislation.qld.gov.au/LEGISLTN/CURRENT/E/ElectricalSA02.pdf page 25


I cant be bothered explaining it all but I will take a short cut

Are you an engineer as per http://www.legislation.qld.gov.au/LEGISLTN/CURRENT/P/ProfEnginA02.pdf

if so you are exempt from needing a license as per

http://www.legislation.qld.gov.au/LEGISLTN/CURRENT/E/ElectricalSA02.pdf

page 49

55 (3) (B)

A person is not required under subsection (1) to hold an
electrical work licence for the purpose of the following—

performance or supervision of electrical work in
practising the person’s profession as an electrical
engineer;

While you are at work you can do as you please if it is your job.
09:01pm 20/01/12 Permalink
BassMan
Brisbane, Queensland
1509 posts
Timmeh - I assuming you're referring to the popular email forward of that Yankee 1950's sparky manual? US use a 60 Hz 110 VAC standard, we use 50 HZ 240 VAC. Getting hit with 240 V hurts (best case scenario) & kills (worst case scenario).

last edited by BassMan at 21:08:37 20/Jan/12
09:03pm 20/01/12 Permalink
Whoop
Brisbane, Queensland
19261 posts
# What's the difference between the neutral & earth conductors?
# What's a MEN link?

neutral is what gear you put the electricity in when you want it to stop moving. Earth is the one made out of dirt.
MEN link is when two poofs hook up
09:07pm 20/01/12 Permalink
thermite
Brisbane, Queensland
8751 posts
230v actually as of the year 2000
09:07pm 20/01/12 Permalink
Timmeh
Brisbane, Queensland
1756 posts
Timmeh - I assuming you're referring to the popular email forward of that Yankee 1950's sparky manual? US use a 60 Hz 110 VAC standard, we use 50 HZ 240 VAC. Getting hit with 240 V hurts (best case scenario) & kills (worst case scenario).last edited by BassMan at 21:08:37 20/Jan/12

yes I was :)

Shame we use 50z though, that is the frequency in which current finds resonance within the human body.

230v actually as of the year 2000


Actually its 230V +10%/-6%
09:27pm 20/01/12 Permalink
BassMan
Brisbane, Queensland
1510 posts
All the Energex 11kV pole top & padmount transformers are still manufactured with 415 V secondaries (433 V no-load).

415 V / sqrt(3) = ~239 V

...I've still not seen any of these 'new' transformers with 400 V secondary windings.

(I don't typically deal with anything less than 11 kV, so my knowledge of LV is a bit hazy. Leave it to AS3000.)
09:48pm 20/01/12 Permalink
teq
Brisbane, Queensland
12319 posts
# What's the difference between the neutral & earth conductors?
# What's a MEN link?


neutral is what gear you put the electricity in when you want it to stop moving. Earth is the one made out of dirt.
MEN link is when two poofs hook up


trolololol

BassMan, I don't know what a MEN link is, nor do I care.
The simple fact is, when I need an additional power point on a circuit that is plainly visible and exposed 3 core all the way from an existing GPO back to the RCD, I'm not going to call someone who probably wont show up, if they did show up would charge me $150~

same thing when a light fixture needs replacing, I would not only have to hand over $100-200, I would also have to hand over a man card
Explain to me what is unsafe about walking down to the fuse box, unlocking it, flicking off the mains, closing it, locking it, going back up to the light fitting in question, testing the circuit with my multi and then replacing the broken fixture

is the concern that I can't tell the difference between active, neutral and earth?
09:51pm 20/01/12 Permalink
konstie
Melbourne, Victoria
1915 posts
fark we have a sparky stand off
09:59pm 20/01/12 Permalink
BassMan
Brisbane, Queensland
1511 posts
teq - you wire the new GPO with undersized conductor, such that the additional impedance now means the upstream MCB/ceramic fuse will no longer blow (if you've got RCD protection on all your circuits you're ok however).

Swap the neutral & earth and your RCD will continually trip.

A 'do-it-yourself-sparky' wouldn't be testing the insulation of their new circuit with a megger, so you could be installing f***ed conductor - a potential fire hazard in your house waiting to happen.

In the land of HV we megger & hi-pot all conductor, ductor test all joints & soak transformers to find flaws before we put plant into service. It's obviously not as involved for LV, but the same concepts apply.
10:09pm 20/01/12 Permalink
teq
Brisbane, Queensland
12321 posts
yeah look I get that it's something which is 'better safe than sorry' territory, really I do
but the fact is I have a modern board, RCDs on every circuit as well as separate mains for the first board, second board and the hot water system
I never do anything without completely securing the whole board, making sure there is no power anywhere in the house, just in case the circuit breaker I thought I turned off is somehow joined to another circuit or has some other kind of silly buggers going on

It would be really really difficult to hurt myself, at worst I might break an rcd when I flick the power back on after I've changed something - at which point I would stop and call a sparky anyway (I do have my limits, installing a new circuit from scratch is not something I would do)

I do have some clue, I'm ACMA licensed which does a bit of work with LV stuff (usually <75V DC and never over 240AC) so it's not like I'm completely unaware of the basics of earthing, induced voltage, cable separation etc

If I could do a course at tafe where I came out of it at the end with a license to do my own electrical work, I'd be all over it
but there's no way in hell I'm going to do 4 years as an apprentice on s*** money, although I did consider it when I was a teenager
10:19pm 20/01/12 Permalink
Denominator
Brisbane, Queensland
913 posts
A 'do-it-yourself-sparky' wouldn't be testing the insulation of their new circuit with a megger, so you could be installing f***ed conductor - a potential fire hazard in your house waiting to happen.


you concern me Bassman as a megga wont show a faultily conductor that is why they introduced fault loop Independence testing
10:24pm 20/01/12 Permalink
BassMan
Brisbane, Queensland
1512 posts
Denomintor - I'm not an LV guy, but if your insulation was dodgy between your cores, simply measuring the resistance of the loop wouldn't pick this up. The only way to detect dodgy insulation is to stress it with a megger? Wouldn't measuring the loop resistance only tell you 1) the loop impedance is too high or 2) an open circuit exists somewhere?

As I mentioned to teq, installing undersized conductor is a great way to end up with a too-high loop impedance, rendering your upstream protection device useless. However, using RCDs means you don't have to do this test, aka AS3000.

On HV cables we use a megger to test the integrity of the sheath & primary insulation, then VLF injection (0.1 Hz) to stress the insulation to over 2x the cable's rated voltage.
11:27pm 20/01/12 Permalink
Timmeh
Brisbane, Queensland
1757 posts
The concern is not with your knowledge but your workmanship and public liability
You do not have insurance and if, god for bid you overlook something wtc and you kill your kids/ wife / tenants.

As for forking over cash for somebody to perform a task they are legally deemed component in and have spent years learning these skills. I think you know the righ answer .
11:43pm 20/01/12 Permalink
Denominator
Brisbane, Queensland
914 posts
Yes Bassman you just should have used the word cable not conductor because it would show faulty insulation.

Denomintor - I'm not an LV guy, but if your insulation was dodgy between your cores, simply measuring the resistance of the loop wouldn't pick this up. The only way to detect dodgy insulation is to stress it with a megger? Wouldn't measuring the loop resistance only tell you 1) the loop impedance is too high or 2) an open circuit exists somewhere?

As I mentioned to teq, installing undersized conductor is a great way to end up with a too-high loop impedance, rendering your upstream protection device useless. However, using RCDs means you don't have to do this test, aka AS3000.


Yes Yes and Yes

The main reason people should not do there own work is that your insurance company may not pay out if you did the work. Insurance company love to keep your money. Could you live with yourself if you killed one of you kids to save $150.


The most dangerous fault in my opinion is an switched neutral to a light socket. Lets say its an old house with no rcd on light circuit which was common practice 8 years ago. Your teenager is kicking a ball around in the garage and smashes a light globe.

The kid decides to fix it before anyone finds out he makes sure the light switch is off uses dads cheap metal ladder on the concrete floor. The bulb is smashed so he uses paper towel to push the bulb up and twist bam a shocking event happens he falls off the ladder and smacks head on concrete. If you can't understand how this could happen maybe give a sparky a call to do the work for you.

I do think you should be able to do a course that teaches this stuff and does hands on stuff so you can do this stuff at home and you can.
11:59pm 20/01/12 Permalink
Captain Lateral
Brisbane, Queensland
4315 posts
Explain to me what is unsafe about walking down to the fuse box, unlocking it, flicking off the mains, closing it, locking it, going back up to the light fitting in question, testing the circuit with my multi and then replacing the broken fixture
the big risk in DIY isn't in you killing your self while working on the electrical connectors, the risk is in the house burning down 5 or 10 years later.
03:16am 21/01/12 Permalink
teq
Brisbane, Queensland
12326 posts
that's a risk no matter who does the work if they don't follow the standards outlined in AS3000
04:43am 21/01/12 Permalink
skythra
Brisbane, Queensland
5114 posts
Just wanted to mention that if you do your own electrical work, b ut don't follow the standard and someone else comes along and electrocutes themselves beacuse you've done something that shouldn't happen.. well you're still the bad guy. most houses stand for 20+ years so expect that when you leave your bad workmanship will stay.
04:57am 21/01/12 Permalink
teq
Brisbane, Queensland
12327 posts
assuming it was bad workmanship to begin with of course
06:50am 21/01/12 Permalink
Jc_23
Brisbane, Queensland
359 posts
I know you are a gun at a lot of things, you are cluey and you back yourself at the end of the day teq, but you really shouldn't be doing any of that stuff. None. Zero. Zilch. No Touchy yo. I think you might have tradesman envy - I've seen a lot of fly by nighters try to do stuff themselves in heaps of trades without the proper indentures and it's never pretty - it's 4 years of constant full-time practical and theoretical learning! :)

07:06am 21/01/12 Permalink
iTOM
Brisbane, Queensland
1212 posts
i'm with teq. f*** off needing a licence to do some basic s*** that any man and his dog can do. my dad is probably better than half the licensed electricians out there
07:37am 21/01/12 Permalink
Timmeh
Brisbane, Queensland
1758 posts
How is this not getting to you?

You are an unlicensed, untrained and uninsured in the electrical field.
You are poking around in an area that you have extremely basic knowledge in.
Knowing what size cable to use for light circuits or matching green to green red to red black to black is taught in the first 2 days of prevocational. Not knowing what a MEN is, is showing you dong give two f**** about the regulations or electrical safety.

Quote:
27 Obligation offence provision
A person on whom an electrical safety obligation is imposed must discharge the obligation.
Maximum penalty—
(a) if the breach causes multiple deaths—2000 penalty units or 3 years imprisonment; or
(b) if the breach causes death or grievous bodily harm—1000 penalty units or 2 years imprisonment; or
(c) if the breach causes bodily harm—750 penalty units or 1 year’s imprisonment; or
(d) otherwise—500 penalty units or 6 months imprisonment.

At the moment 1 penalty unit is $75.

So your unlicensed work carries a maximum fine of $37,500.
It is worth noting that the standard of your workmanship, or its compliance to AS or whatever standard, in this case is irrelevant. The cold hard fact is that if you perform this work without a licence, That is illegal and no insurance company would ever cover you.

These are not guidelines, this is law.

Also take a moment to consider this does not include civil actions that your 'landlord ot tenatants or future home owners' may file against you if there is property damaged as a result of your work.

You might beat your chest in this forum and think yourself quite clever with your somewhat immature point of view, but the reality is that people have given sound advice based on their knowledge and experience.

People that I work with have seen others prosecuted for unlicenced work. Some have seen people jailed for the more serious offences. You may think you have proven your point here but I wonder how you would go when up in front of a magistrate. I don't know about you but I tend to avoid getting into that situation.
11:09am 21/01/12 Permalink
Denominator
Brisbane, Queensland
915 posts
my dad is probably better than half the licensed electricians out there


Send him to my work and we will see about that.

Timmeh it is hard to prove unlicensed work. Some people think that they will do a better job than a sparky because they will clip the cable up and make it look all neat and stuff. I herd a story that someone was using a staple gun to put tps onto a wall, putting the staple through the middle of the wire. When confronted he said its only the earth.

Why did we do a four year apprenticeship just so we could argue on forums.

http://www.justice.qld.gov.au/__data/assets/image/0020/75224/Image-2.gif
01:38pm 21/01/12 Permalink
Ivonin
Brisbane, Queensland
976 posts
As an industrial sparky myself, if the guy was a better sparky in the vid, that wouldn't have happened.

The amount of s*** we go through to do the same job with putting up protection, wearing arc helmets, gloves, safety stand by guys with plastic hooks, rubber matting, isolation etc... etc... etc... make it almost impossible for this to happen.

If he was at fault, I hate to say it, take his license off of him. He shouldn't be on any crew again, he is a danger to not only himself, but to others.
02:20pm 21/01/12 Permalink
teq
Brisbane, Queensland
12328 posts
blah blah blah, im not replacing any cable so i can't get the size wrong
im replacing GPOs and light fixtures, the wiring is already there, the wire i used to run extra gpos was given to me by a sparky who said "use this"

sook more, im not paying someone to replace gpos and light fixtures, it's really basic s*** that anyone should be allowed to do.
03:33pm 21/01/12 Permalink
Timmeh
Brisbane, Queensland
1761 posts
blah blah blah, im not replacing any cable so i can't get the size wrong
im replacing GPOs and light fixtures, the wiring is already there, the wire i used to run extra gpos was given to me by a sparky who said "use this"

sook more, im not paying someone to replace gpos and light fixtures, it's really basic s*** that anyone should be allowed to do.

Did you clip the cable when it passed through roof space that is accessible(>500m)?
Did you make sure the cable was segregated from other cable runs to avoid induced voltage?
Did you make sure the cable was away from any roof access or lighting?
How much did you strip back? did you put a shroud on the back of the gpo? Did it need one?
Will adding a GPO to this circuit cause the circuit to be overloaded?
Did you mix circuits?
Did you test?Polarity?Continuity?Loop Impedance? RCD trip time? What is the trip time spose to be?

Basic s***, for a skilled electrician.
03:45pm 21/01/12 Permalink
teq
Brisbane, Queensland
12331 posts
nope, I took one GPO off and put another one on because the 30 year old one broke

I'm not sure if you own a house timmeh, but if you do, would you do your own cat6 cabling?
what about installing a water tank?
plumbing your dishwasher?
installing the cold water line for a fridge?

none of these things are legal, everyone does them
08:07pm 21/01/12 Permalink
Timmeh
Brisbane, Queensland
1764 posts
nope, I took one GPO off and put another one on because the 30 year old one broke

I'm not sure if you own a house timmeh, but if you do, would you do your own cat6 cabling?
what about installing a water tank?
plumbing your dishwasher?
installing the cold water line for a fridge?

none of these things are legal, everyone does them

I have done my own cat5e cabling although I did not connect to the existing Comms so i basically ran Ethernet inside the walls. Not illegal.

I have not done any of the above
There is a difference, a severe difference. If you cant see this you have problem.
Were talking about goverment regulated and run power supply.
09:29pm 21/01/12 Permalink
teq
Brisbane, Queensland
12332 posts
you have failed to convince me that what I'm doing is dangerous
swapping GPOs and light fixtures is 0 risk, I'll continue to do it and you can continue to get your panties in a bunch about it

btw whats your address so I can come over and inspect your cat5e, just to make sure its up to code, if i find anything dodgy i have to report you to the ACMA
02:56am 22/01/12 Permalink
thermite
Brisbane, Queensland
8761 posts
Not questioning your skills, but this is probably the sort of thing that could f*** up your insurance claim when your house burns down teq.
03:15am 22/01/12 Permalink
teq
Brisbane, Queensland
12335 posts
it could be argued that nothing could have gone wrong so badly that a fire was caused by anything north of the load centre
any gpos or fixtures that are on rcds are not at risk, if there's a problem in the load centre that i have never touched, it can't be the fault of anything I touched

all circuits on rcds = pretty good safety measure
04:15am 22/01/12 Permalink
spoon
Brisbane, Queensland
466 posts
any gpos or fixtures that are on rcds are not at risk,


derp
05:52am 22/01/12 Permalink
Denominator
Brisbane, Queensland
916 posts
any gpos or fixtures that are on rcds are not at risk,


Wrong

This is why you should ring a sparky. RCD's protect people (active to earth) they don't protect the cable from catching on fire.
10:21am 22/01/12 Permalink
infi
Brisbane, Queensland
18297 posts
such a sad, yet happy story.

OH NOW I AM GETTING EMOTIONAL
10:39am 22/01/12 Permalink
Jc_23
Brisbane, Queensland
368 posts
Careful infi, those things will reduce the stress levels that you thrive on, impeding performance which will in turn result in more people being employed! :p
11:13am 22/01/12 Permalink
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