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We sit down with Blizzard's Ion Hazzikostas to talk all things World of Warcraft, including upcoming expansion Warlords of Draenor.
Talking Draenor with Ion Hazzikostas
Authorities gain power to collect Australians' internet records
Tremble
Brisbane, Queensland
438 posts
Laws passed today will allow authorities to collect and keep Australians' internet records, including their web-browsing history, social media activity and emails.
Attorney-General Nicola Roxon said the laws would help police track cyber-criminals around the globe, and would give authorities the power to find people engaged in forgery, fraud, child pornography, and infringement of copyright and intellectual property.


article here

So it seems that the authorities can track and record our internet records now.

I wonder what needs to happen in the way of warrants to start having your internet activities tracked, I thought the cops could already do this?
10:41pm 22/08/12 Permalink
system
Internet
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10:41pm 22/08/12 Permalink
FaceMan
Brisbane, Queensland
9231 posts
10:49pm 22/08/12 Permalink
BoDGie
Brisbane, Queensland
588 posts
The changes allow police to force telcos to retain data on persons of interest for a set period while a warrant is sought.


No warrant necessary to begin logging by the sounds of it. Just intention to get one.

http://www.itnews.com.au/News/312771,senate-passes-data-retention-bill.aspx
10:50pm 22/08/12 Permalink
dais
Brisbane, Queensland
10025 posts
You're my friend FaceMan.
10:50pm 22/08/12 Permalink
Dothtin
Canberra, Australian Capital Territory
4 posts
11:39pm 22/08/12 Permalink
Whoop
Brisbane, Queensland
20469 posts
m-m-m-m-m-mobilephone
12:10am 23/08/12 Permalink
cainer
Brisbane, Queensland
1814 posts
so whats stopping us from spending $5/month to use an non recorded VPN service like BTGuard ?

hence the laws are stupid, anyone who wants to commit an internet crime by viewing something illegal will use a VPN or Tor.
12:30am 23/08/12 Permalink
deadlyf
Queensland
2746 posts
Is that a VPN connection that is encrypted?

I think even if they log encrypted data doesn't the Encryptee have to send you an encryption key, which they have then logged?

Or do VPN's completely bi-pass your ISP entirely?
12:41am 23/08/12 Permalink
Pinky
Melbourne, Victoria
13620 posts
Thinking of basic things, like email for example, how would this even work for GMail when using HTTPS as default?

The connection between your browser and the GMail server is secured.
12:44am 23/08/12 Permalink
redhat
Sydney, New South Wales
818 posts
Google would have to fork over emails unless they got an ssl cert which your browser trusted.

I can see Facebook or M$ handing anything over but the Google has stood up to guberments before*


*citation needed
06:56am 23/08/12 Permalink
Scooter
Brisbane, Queensland
6000 posts
If you're a person of Interest.*
Sort of like getting a warrent to search your house... but they can see who's visited in the past 2 years as well.
07:18am 23/08/12 Permalink
Captain Lateral
Brisbane, Queensland
4581 posts
and no one cares...

Unprecedented powers to the government under the guise of supporting the entertainment industries business model? sure! why not?
07:46am 23/08/12 Permalink
Spook
Brisbane, Queensland
34150 posts
tor <3
07:52am 23/08/12 Permalink
Mosfx
Gold Coast, Queensland
1227 posts
Doesn't worry me I don't commit crimes, and if the Police want to see how many hours I rack up watching porn and YouTube videos then be my guest they obviously don't have anything better to do.
08:04am 23/08/12 Permalink
Captain Lateral
Brisbane, Queensland
4582 posts
08:13am 23/08/12 Permalink
natslovR
Sydney, New South Wales
7890 posts
It can be used to target copyright infringement (according to SmH article) and what about when the government decides to redo its Internet filtering and says that you can only view X rated if you reside in a territory where that's legally for sale? Or even that content must be classified for you to view it

Or they start enforcing the existing Internet gambling laws

I'm not faceman, but your pirate tv, porn and poker can all be targeted with ease and then you would be "committing crimes".
08:19am 23/08/12 Permalink
TufNuT
I like eel pie
Brisbane, Queensland
3959 posts
how many hours I rack up watching porn and YouTube videos


do you pay for the porn? are you 100% sure the webiste you are using screens every video to ensure that no under age people are being used in the video?

these Youtube video's, whos the copyright owner? ever download a torrent of something that will never be released in Australia? guess what you just broke the law in all cases, i cant look for the article now, but there have been cases of people being jailed for visiting a p0rn site not knowing that there are illegal video on the site and being jailed for it.

think again criminal citizen.
09:13am 23/08/12 Permalink
thermite
Brisbane, Queensland
10078 posts
I can't keep up with all the rights i've lost anymore


You'd be surprised at the sorts of common porn that is actually illegal in Australia. I found out on those border patrol shows.
09:50am 23/08/12 Permalink
dais
Brisbane, Queensland
10036 posts
*preemptively deletes all porn*
09:56am 23/08/12 Permalink
natslovR
Sydney, New South Wales
7892 posts
No, you should have been hoarding LEGAL porn up till now. It's future porn you access that they can log. Time to get out those dvd's full of xvids and pretend they are new. You probably only watched the first few minutes anyway.
10:02am 23/08/12 Permalink
thermite
Brisbane, Queensland
10079 posts
so true
10:14am 23/08/12 Permalink
dais
Brisbane, Queensland
10039 posts
What the f*****g s***?

Female ejaculation, a bodily function recognised by the scientific and medical community is still said to be a form of urination by the Classification Board and given the dreaded RC rating as an offensive fetish. This "flat earth" interpretation of basic female biology was used to convict Australia’s largest producer of X rated content earlier this year. One of the films which police used in evidence to convict the Melbourne-based Abbywinters.com was said to be an RC film requiring a tougher penalty than an X film because it showed a young woman masturbating to orgasm and then inexplicably urinating as she came. While the biology that underpins all this media may seem below the brief of nine suited and saintly SCAG members, it is exactly this attitude that is seeing people fined and jailed on spurious 19th century notions of moral propriety. (As a postscript to this story, the AbbyWinters company fled Australia days after they were fined and relocated in Europe where everything they were doing was perfectly legal).

The increasing numbers of young women presenting for labiaplasty because they only see Photoshopped images of vaginas in their partner’s adult publications is also a matter for SCAG to address as well. Why do the Classification Guidelines state that depictions of women with "outies" are more offensive than women with a neatly zipped pudenda? Its like saying that an image of a circumcised man is more offensive than one who is not. Who made this ruling and why is it not subjected to some sort of rational review?


http://newmatilda.com/2010/11/22/classification-regime-doesnt-rate-well
10:25am 23/08/12 Permalink
thermite
Brisbane, Queensland
10080 posts
Yeah any moisture on the girl down there and you're going to jail. Who knows what else. If the tits are too small, you're watching CP
10:33am 23/08/12 Permalink
dais
Brisbane, Queensland
10040 posts
Yeah I saw that about the A cups as well.

http://www.crikey.com.au/2010/01/29/has-australia-really-banned-small-breasts/

last edited by dais at 10:42:23 23/Aug/12
10:38am 23/08/12 Permalink
dais
Brisbane, Queensland
10043 posts
That s*** about women who appear to be under 18 is f***ed in the head. They base it on things like their clothes or cup size.

They're either over 18 or they're not. It's about the legal age of the performer, not the ridiculous and unfounded idea that seeing small tits will make someone a pedophile.

last edited by dais at 10:54:34 23/Aug/12
10:53am 23/08/12 Permalink
Pinky
Melbourne, Victoria
13622 posts
You probably only watched the first few minutes anyway.
http://img253.imageshack.us/img253/9246/porniwatch.jpg

Agree that FaceBook would probably hand over any data by request. I think there is a precedent for that, in fact.

I can think of lots of ways that HTTPS is used and AFAIK any data collected would be useless to law enforcement.
11:32am 23/08/12 Permalink
WirlWind
Central Coast, New South Wales
318 posts
Meh, they'll find my history a mix of gaming, forums, porn and youtube.

Don't really care that they'll see it, but the fact that they can do it s**** me.
11:33am 23/08/12 Permalink
TicMan
Melbourne, Victoria
8151 posts
Just wait until the government start price controlling wine because apparently it's too cheap!

Australia in the 21st century is turning into Russia from the 20th century but without the snow.
11:35am 23/08/12 Permalink
thermite
Brisbane, Queensland
10083 posts
I wonder if having a go at the government on brisbanetimes will get you waterboarded or some s***
11:40am 23/08/12 Permalink
Pinky
Melbourne, Victoria
13623 posts
I wonder if having a go at the government on brisbanetimes will get you waterboarded or some s***

They'd all read the Courier, surely?
11:41am 23/08/12 Permalink
ravn0s
Brisbane, Queensland
15769 posts
so that's what the whole thing was with abbywinters. i thought it was because the authorities believed a few of the women were underage.
11:54am 23/08/12 Permalink
scuzzy
Brisbane, Queensland
15458 posts
Just wait until the government start price controlling wine because apparently it's too cheap!
who the f*** goes to hospital over wine, UDL's and Vodka yes I can understand.
11:59am 23/08/12 Permalink
Pinky
Melbourne, Victoria
13624 posts
who the f*** goes to hospital over wine, UDL's and Vodka yes I can understand.

Wine is the 'go to' for alcos. Always has been.

Cask wine in the past, but since the wine glut Cleanskins are obviously cheap too. 750mL Cleanskin is $4 a bottle. I buy them often.
12:05pm 23/08/12 Permalink
skythra
Brisbane, Queensland
6014 posts
Wine is the 'go to' for alcos. Always has been. Cask wine in the past, but since the wine glut Cleanskins are obviously cheap too. 750mL Cleanskin is $4 a bottle. I buy them often.

I don't think the laws to do with candy pop premix drinks had anything to do with alcoholism.
12:52pm 23/08/12 Permalink
Captain Lateral
Brisbane, Queensland
4584 posts
Meh, they'll find my history a mix of gaming, forums, porn and youtube.


Er, hope your porn isn't weird at all, or too hardcore(and by that definition explicit images of penetration), cause the whole point of this is you could be profiled and then fined at a later date, or worse jailed.... for looking at the "wrong" type of porn.

01:03pm 23/08/12 Permalink
TicMan
Melbourne, Victoria
8152 posts
Hypothetically speaking if you host your own bedroom shots on a remote web server that includes "hardcore" footage - would you get pinged for looking at yourself or pinged for doing the act or both!?
01:13pm 23/08/12 Permalink
TufNuT
I like eel pie
Brisbane, Queensland
3960 posts
seriously this s**** me. i don't understand how this stuff gets passed and one seems to do anything about it.. i don't remember seeing any GetUp campaigns about this (beside Getup seems kida useless anyway) I mean you have people taking the government to the high court over Asylum seekers rights but i don't recall hearing anyone challenging this.
01:18pm 23/08/12 Permalink
thermite
Brisbane, Queensland
10084 posts
Internet pornography will be ‘prohibited’ by ACMA if certain classification thresholds are met. These thresholds form part of the National Classification Scheme (which also applies to other forms of media such as publications, films and video games) and are agreed by the Attorneys-General of the Commonwealth, States and Territories.

The thresholds are articulated in a National Classification Code and in Guidelines. The Classification Board (part of the Attorney-General’s Department) is Australia’s official classification body. In the course of investigating potentially prohibited internet content, ACMA may seek a formal classification decision from the Classification Board, or it may make its own assessment of the content against the National Classification Code and in Guidelines.
In summary, the following categories of internet content are prohibited:
• Content classifiable as ‘RC’ (‘refused classification’). Such content includes, for example, illegal material (such as child sexual abuse material) and other highly offensive material (such as bestiality).
• Content classifiable as ‘X18+’. Such content includes material containing real depictions of actual sexual activity.
• Content hosted in Australia which is classified ‘R18+’ and not subject to a restricted access system which complies with criteria determined by ACMA. Content classified R18+ is not considered suitable for minors. Such content includes, for example, material containing implied (or simulated) sexual activity.

Internet pornography will be prohibited if it falls within the ‘RC’ or ‘X18+’ classifications or, for content hosted in Australia that is not restricted by an adult verification procedure, if it falls within the ‘R18+’ classification.



let me just requote the part that is interesting

the following categories of internet content are prohibited: material containing real depictions of actual sexual activity



so.... pretty much everything I've ever seen?


source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legal_status_of_Internet_pornography
01:23pm 23/08/12 Permalink
Sc00bs
Brisbane, Queensland
8966 posts
who gives a f***, they can look at whatever records they want what are they goin to do ? throw everyone that has download stuff or watched porn they dont agree with ?

I think not....


+ ppl are smart enough with the internet these days that some stupid government filter/block/ whatever they do will easily be surpassed by someone with half a brain and minimal knowledge of the internet.

01:33pm 23/08/12 Permalink
Pinky
Melbourne, Victoria
13626 posts
So, Sc00bs, you're ok with the creation of unenforceable laws?
01:36pm 23/08/12 Permalink
thermite
Brisbane, Queensland
10085 posts
Yes people who want to do something illegal on purpose will know how to get around it.


Poor d******* who downloaded a trojan or left their wifi open, won't have a f*****g clue, won't be able to explain what happened to the cops/court, and there goes his career.

throw everyone that has download stuff or watched porn they dont agree with ?


Yes but that's the same with speeding. People speed, when everyone is speeding, and think "what are they gonna do? pull everyone over?".
Then when they get the fine they go "but everyone was speeding!!" - that excuse doesn't work. They catch who they catch, even though everyone is doing it.

last edited by thermite at 13:39:03 23/Aug/12
01:37pm 23/08/12 Permalink
Hogfather
Cairns, Queensland
12660 posts
who gives a f***, they can look at whatever records they want what are they goin to do ? throw everyone that has download stuff or watched porn they dont agree with ?

Yeah, I can't imagine a use for draconian laws that can apply to almost anyone, but in practice are used to only send a few people to jail.

Oh wait, yes I can.
01:46pm 23/08/12 Permalink
dais
Brisbane, Queensland
10049 posts
Yes but that's the same with speeding. People speed, when everyone is speeding, and think "what are they gonna do? pull everyone over?". Then when they get the fine they go "but everyone was speeding!!" - that excuse doesn't work. They catch who they catch, even though everyone is doing it.


Yeah a perfect example is the mums in the USA who got fined $40,000 for downloading songs.
02:08pm 23/08/12 Permalink
D-Sub
Brisbane, Queensland
225 posts
All this talk of porn...
03:03pm 23/08/12 Permalink
Superform
Netherlands
7502 posts
people need to take australia back
03:30pm 23/08/12 Permalink
Trauma
Melbourne, Victoria
2856 posts
Agree that FaceBook would probably hand over any data by request. I think there is a precedent for that
Relevant
04:05pm 23/08/12 Permalink
JakeG
Thailand
1112 posts
Was this in any media prior to it being announced as passed through?
05:17pm 23/08/12 Permalink
WirlWind
Central Coast, New South Wales
319 posts


Er, hope your porn isn't weird at all, or too hardcore(and by that definition explicit images of penetration), cause the whole point of this is you could be profiled and then fined at a later date, or worse jailed.... for looking at the "wrong" type of porn.


Well s***...

Now that I think about it, I'm fairly sure I've watched some f***ed up stuff, so who knows.

If that's the case, then please... smuggle me in some kleenex while I'm in the big-house...
05:27pm 23/08/12 Permalink
skythra
Brisbane, Queensland
6024 posts
Yeah where was hack complaining! It was because tony abbot was busy talking about his thoughts about music during when this probably was actually an issue.

Politicians are supposed to represent the will of the people, but who asked for this? The parents saying "Think of the children"? I don't think so.

Personally i might be in a weird stance i'm not against child porn, i am against the creation of child pornography. Where someone harms a child by taking advantage of one (or more) and then worse creates photographic evidence. As for the images afterwards? That is far less worse than the initial crime.

All these things just hide the problem instead of seeking out a solution to the issue.

As for childporn, i don't like it, i think it's gross. But I just want to make it clear that stopping distribution of childporn doesn't stop the harming of children. Hell it probably won't even slow it. It just convicts people often who have never done a thing bad to children (but are probably quite f***ed up) and leaves the initial problem people unharmed.

Therefore, any justification for things like 'saving the children' being used to implement laws which are so vague that at any point in time they have enough information to convict anyone then there's obviously a problem. A problem where they will be abused, if not now, then in 10 years time.

The other law i'm pissed about is the one which says you can't associate with convicted criminals in NSW. If you are asked three times to get away from a convicted criminal, then you've convicted a criminal offence. The attorney general says that "Convicted criminals are bad and good people shouldn't associate with them" but the truth is if you work with, friends of or date someone who's made a mistake (maybe drove too fast, or one of many minor criminal things) then you yourself could do 5 years of jail and now should be ostracised from society unable to create human relationships naturally or feel part of society without potentially getting on the wrong side of an officer and having someone else convicted as a criminal like you were.

People in australia don't stand up.
05:32pm 23/08/12 Permalink
natslovR
Sydney, New South Wales
7902 posts
You can be 100% certain that facebook and google will hand over records of your activity to Australian police if instructed to by Australian courts. There is no doubt. They are not in the business of protecting your information or their relationship with you from the law.

Even companies who's business is protecting you communications will hand over the information when instructed. Hushmail installed a backdoor in their client to capture a users pass phrase so that the police could decrypt a particular users' messages when they were served with the appropriate documents by law enforcement.
http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2007/11/hushmail-to-war/
05:36pm 23/08/12 Permalink
Whoop
Brisbane, Queensland
20471 posts
people need to take australia back

you mean the country we stole?
05:41pm 23/08/12 Permalink
Captain Lateral
Brisbane, Queensland
4586 posts
It just convicts people often who have never done a thing bad to children (but are probably quite f***ed up) and leaves the initial problem people unharmed.


Not necessarily, don't they classify small boobed women even if they are over 18, to be "depicting a child" in porn and get you that way?

Australian police if instructed to by Australian courts.
luckily now they don't require a court order to get that data. :)

Politicians are supposed to represent the will of the people, but who asked for this?
no one, but they've been circling the controlling the internet drain for a while. there is continual "closed door discussions". This isn't the first time either, the government rushed through ACTA (the bill that several European countries denied because it violated the rights of their citizens) the same way. "not in the publics interest to discuss" bull s***.

you mean the country we stole?
This country has never been for the people. its been a penal colony, then a commonwealth nation, now its standing on its own 2 feet but still submits to the authority of the crown... We should demand a referendum like in 2001, we want the peoples president to be in power. not the leader of a party, which changes and sells out. both parties have good candidates, but internal party politics is destroying any chance for real representation of the Australian people.

08:46am 24/08/12 Permalink
thermite
Brisbane, Queensland
10092 posts
People in australia don't stand up.


Correct.

Australians are a bunch of lazy brainwashed sooks that wouldn't dare do anything to upset the establishment.

If a politician steps out of line in France.... say goodbye to your car, because it will be burned. As it should be. You are part of the voting public, you should be punished.

Here people would get all precious "Oooh don't touch my car you smelly hippies".

Weak.
10:26am 24/08/12 Permalink
natslovR
Sydney, New South Wales
7904 posts
luckily now they don't require a court order to get that data. :)


Article says they can ask an ISP to start collecting the data, but can't view it until they have a warrant

Google and Facebook are not my ISP, they are services I use, so nothing's change there. They would continue to be subject to the existing laws not this new ISP one, where they can instruct your ISP to stop deleting your usage data while they get a warrant.

But I haven't read the law, so don't know for sure.
01:41pm 24/08/12 Permalink
Shaexen
Brisbane, Queensland
516 posts
The main problem with rights in general is that they are most often revoked just when they are needed most.

Both sides of Australian politics have slowly but surely eroding our rights and nobody seems to care.
01:49pm 24/08/12 Permalink
Alize`
Brisbane, Queensland
1674 posts
So I share my house with 3 other weird dudes who no doubt watch some terrible porn but the TPG contract is on my name... Does that mean I'll be the only person targeted or will they be able to determine computers that downloaded it etc. if it comes to being that serious?
02:20pm 24/08/12 Permalink
thermite
Brisbane, Queensland
10101 posts
Alize`, ideally you would deny any knowledge once, don't elaborate about the weird dudes, refuse a formal interview, and be aware that police record anything you say via Voice Recorders they carry in their pockets. If you are suspected of a crime, offering your own theories on what happened will just get you in the s***, since "you wouldn't be a suspect if it wasn't obvious that you are a criminal". Plus it's not your problem to help detectives to do their job. Call a lawyer to straighten it out. Unfortunately you may wind up having to go to court, spend a lot of money on the lawyer, and go through months of stress and a trial while you may be on bail conditions or living in jail (apparently our society likes the 'presumed guilty' treatment). Employ IT professionals and witnesses to testify about the weird dudes on your behalf and you will probably get off. The court may award you costs, which are a fraction of what you actually spent on legal fees, not to mention your own time and effort. If you didn't have the money for the lawyer, you'll probably be moving into prison for a while. If the prosecutor convinced the court that as the bill payer you are responsible anyway; prison. Welcome to the legal system.

last edited by thermite at 14:38:37 24/Aug/12
02:36pm 24/08/12 Permalink
Sc00bs
Brisbane, Queensland
8972 posts
just u, nice try making up these 'pretend' wierd room mates tho.

Sow the seeds early ;)
02:37pm 24/08/12 Permalink
supernaturalx
Brisbane, Queensland
4 posts
Well if your using firefox

As of August 2012 Firefox does not support TLS 1.1 or 1.2

TLS is SSL which is basically HTTPS and SSL is the original standard which later developed into TLS, although i'm not sure if there is a later version of TLS past 1.2, there doesn't appear to be according to wikipedia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transport_Layer_Security

If you want secure mail

tormail is the way to go.

As of further investigation I have found firefox supports the old SSL Protocol and TLS 1.0, they really should f*****g update to TLS 1.2, in fact it's annoying me so much so that i'm going to send it as feedback.

I will never use google chrome for reasons that should be obvious to anyone who uses google.
04:45am 27/08/12 Permalink
Reverend Evil
Wynnum, Queensland
20854 posts
I'm not saying someone should shoot anyone but don't you miss the days when a person was finally fed up with all this crap and would try and take down the person responsible.
08:52am 27/08/12 Permalink
Captain Lateral
Brisbane, Queensland
4593 posts
I'm not saying someone should shoot anyone but don't you miss the days when a person was finally fed up with all this crap and would try and take down the person responsible.


I guess the question is who is responsible?
09:09am 27/08/12 Permalink
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09:09am 27/08/12 Permalink
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