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LNP believes we all want state based religious education...
Obes
Brisbane, Queensland
9445 posts
“The LNP believe that the overwhelming majority of Queenslanders want their children brought up with a Judeo-Christian grounding in religious education,”

LNP education spokesman Bruce Flegg

not a news.com.au link

He even says muslims want their kids to get a Judeo-Christian grounding ...

But seriously, can't we teach ethics, civics and philosophy to give people a moral code instead ?
Teach all religons as part history.
10:20am 16/11/11 Permalink
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10:20am 16/11/11 Permalink
Raven
Melbourne, Victoria
6154 posts
Why do ethics need to be any more complicated than "Would you be happier if someone did that to you? If not, then don't fucking do it!"
10:24am 16/11/11 Permalink
Jim
UK
12486 posts
because there's all different levels of 'happy if someone did that to you' from person to person - it's not an adequate or consistent measure of whether or not to do something
10:26am 16/11/11 Permalink
thermite
Brisbane, Queensland
8470 posts
So this is if Can do becomes premier? Yeah I thought he looked like the type to go to church and a diddle a kid.
Definitely going for Kate Jones now. Everything about can do is a thumbs down.

I vote in ashgrove motherfuckers, your fate is in my hands.
10:33am 16/11/11 Permalink
fade
Brisbane, Queensland
7091 posts
So this is if Can do becomes premier? Yeah I thought he looked like the type to go to church and a diddle a kid.
Definitely going for Kate Jones now. Everything about can do is a thumbs down.

I vote in ashgrove motherfuckers, your fate is in my hands.

thermite - wouldn't you rather a Can-do lead LNP than not? Because either way LNP are getting in.
10:35am 16/11/11 Permalink
Raven
Melbourne, Victoria
6155 posts
Sometimes a politician who sits on their hands and does nothing for their full term is better than one who turns everything on its head and screws things up beyond repair.
10:38am 16/11/11 Permalink
funky
Brisbane, Queensland
1419 posts
is that a sure thing though? i mean i know labor aren't doing great, but the LNP don't seem to be smashing it either, or am i wrong?

10:40am 16/11/11 Permalink
hardware
Brisbane, Queensland
9790 posts
you're wrong funky. the turn against labor in QLD seats of the recent federal election is an indicator of the detest for state labor in QLD.

last edited by hardware at 10:49:32 16/Nov/11
10:46am 16/11/11 Permalink
demon
Brisbane, Queensland
6563 posts
you're not wrong funky. both lnp & labor are dongs.
10:50am 16/11/11 Permalink
funky
Brisbane, Queensland
1420 posts
yeah i suppose that is true - i am just extremely jaded, i run into each election not really wanting to vote for anyone (plus until this next election, i've lived in really staunch labor areas where they romp home regardless)
10:51am 16/11/11 Permalink
Dazhel
Gold Coast, Queensland
4146 posts
Labor's case appears to be terminal but the LNP has been their own worst enemy for a long while.
Maybe that all translates to a one term premiership for Can Do?
10:53am 16/11/11 Permalink
Tollaz0r!
Brisbane, Queensland
11908 posts
It is a sad state of affairs when we have 2 such lowly regarded major political parties and a new major party hasn't sprung up to storm their way in. I guess us Australians don't have a strong want for something different.
10:59am 16/11/11 Permalink
fade
Brisbane, Queensland
7092 posts
Back to religion; a casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows that faith does not prove anything: Nietzsche.
11:00am 16/11/11 Permalink
greazy
Brisbane, Queensland
5093 posts
Toll: My prediction is that the Greens will surge in power in the coming years.
11:00am 16/11/11 Permalink
taggs
5750 posts
Toll: My prediction is that the Greens will surge in power in the coming years.


i'm more inclined to think the opposite, tbh.

once old bob isn't there to publicly moderate their more extreme members and views they'll eventually go the way of the democrats, imo.

though who really knows when it comes to politics.
11:07am 16/11/11 Permalink
fade
Brisbane, Queensland
7093 posts
^ or once some of their plans are implemented causing horrible and irreparable damage then people will see their complete and utter divorce from the realms of reason and pragmatism.
11:17am 16/11/11 Permalink
Raven
Melbourne, Victoria
6156 posts
The greens aren't going anywhere. They're a radical idealist group that only appeals to those on the far end of one spectrum. It alienates too many average people who don't agree with their core purpose for being there.
11:33am 16/11/11 Permalink
Hogfather
Cairns, Queensland
11261 posts
Hopefully this recent experiment in Greens in the federal Lower House is ample demonstration to the public that its a VERY BAD FUCKING IDEA
11:42am 16/11/11 Permalink
Scooter
Brisbane, Queensland
5121 posts
I really hope the 'Queensland' party doesn't get a leg up in the next state elections. I don't profess to know many of their policies or politicians. However the one I do know, Aidan McLindon, is a rat bastard who only cares about himself and his career and really doesn't give a shit about anyone or anything around him. Least of all his constituents.

He is so bad I would even concider, if only for a second, voting for a Greens member infront of him.
11:49am 16/11/11 Permalink
Eorl
Brisbane, Queensland
4069 posts
Should all just vote for the Pirate Party.
11:50am 16/11/11 Permalink
deadlyf
Queensland
2215 posts
^ or once some of their plans are implemented causing horrible and irreparable damage then people will see their complete and utter divorce from the realms of reason and pragmatism.
Unfortunately the damage is usually done by Greens policies in regional areas they don't vote Greens anyway. Meanwhile in inner city suburbs we still have a large number of fuckwits that think a vote for the Greens is a vote for the environment.

Seriously though something has to change, Liberals conservatism is beginning to become a real dinosaur for the party and Labors throw money at a problem way of handling policy just can't work in this economy.
11:52am 16/11/11 Permalink
trog
AGN Admin
Brisbane, Queensland
35061 posts
Hopefully this recent experiment in Greens in the federal Lower House is ample demonstration to the public that its a VERY BAD FUCKING IDEA
What have the Greens done, aside from helping getting the Carbon Tax passed?
12:07pm 16/11/11 Permalink
DocterMoist
189 posts
This post has been removed.
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12:13pm 16/11/11 Permalink
trog
AGN Admin
Brisbane, Queensland
35062 posts
I asked "what have they done?", not "hey what raving dribbling rubbish comes to mind when you think of the word 'Green'?" Please cite specific examples in response to my question or stay out of this thread.
12:33pm 16/11/11 Permalink
teq
Brisbane, Queensland
11970 posts
yawn

religion has no place in a democratic government
12:34pm 16/11/11 Permalink
FaceMan
Brisbane, Queensland
7580 posts
If kids are old enough to learn about God then they are old enough to learn about Sex and Drugs (and Rock n Roll).

But you cant have just one brand of Religion, all Religions should have the opportunity to brainwash children or none of them.

The most disturbing aspect of this story is that Dr Bruce Flegg is in charge of anything. Hes The LNPs version of Stephen Robertson.
12:38pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Hogfather
Cairns, Queensland
11262 posts
What have the Greens done, aside from helping getting the Carbon Tax passed?

"Helping"? You surely can't be that naive troggles; the carbon tax is the price for the support of the Green seat that allowed the ALP to form Government. There is no way that the Government would have acted without it as its suicide, they just don't have the political power to implement divisive, radical policy at the moment without a mandate.

The Gillard Government needed to be about stable, responsible, perhaps boring governance to claw back the few percent they needed for a full majority in 2013, the carbon tax was directly contrary to their political needs and directions for this term.

Next on the Green's agenda is the complete destruction of the coal and uranium export industries, the same industries that are shielding us from the sort of meltdown we're seeing elsewhere. I don't think its a long bow to draw to suggest that other mining sectors are on the hit list.

They have a ridiculous policy platform to increase spending dramatically; this can only be supported by very deep public debt, a sharp reduction in existing services or a lot more taxes (probably a mixture of all three).
12:44pm 16/11/11 Permalink
greazy
Brisbane, Queensland
5094 posts
Still haven't answered his question. What have the greens done (in the lower house) that was a demonstration for them to be VERY FUCKING BAD IDEA?
12:47pm 16/11/11 Permalink
DirtyApe
Brisbane, Queensland
927 posts
My take on the political parties we have in this country.

They are all huge steaming piles of whale shit.
12:48pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Hogfather
Cairns, Queensland
11263 posts
Still haven't answered his question. What have the greens done (in the lower house) that was a demonstration for them to be VERY FUCKING BAD IDEA?

What? I did answer the question.

Somehow with a single seat they were able to implement the biggest change to tax policy since the GST, all without having to ask those pesky voters what they think about it.
12:49pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Scooter
Brisbane, Queensland
5122 posts
Luckily they haven't been able to do much at all Trog. It's what they want to do that is the problem.
The largest problem I have them is their Anti-Mining, of any kind, stance. No new Coal mines or expansions on existing mines. No Uranium mining, at all. Shutting down existing as well as obviously no new ones.
I have heaps of problems with a lot of their other policies as well. Too many for me to be bothered typing about.

Also, their single lone member put their vote torards forming the bastard of a Labor government we have today, thats something they've done which was a very bad idea.
12:49pm 16/11/11 Permalink
hardware
Brisbane, Queensland
9792 posts
don't the greens want to ban x-rays?
12:52pm 16/11/11 Permalink
trog
AGN Admin
Brisbane, Queensland
35063 posts
So... aside from the Carbon Tax (whether we call it "helping" or not)... what else have they done? I don't want to get drawn into another long boring debate about whether the Carbon Tax is worth doing and I'm genuinely curious if there are other specific things that they have done that you are referring to, or if you are solely and exclusively talking about the Carbon Tax.

The reason I'm asking is because I am wondering if voting Greens - regardless of what you think about their policies - is better or worse for the country than voting Labor or Liberal simply because you hate one of those parties a little bit less than the other ones.

The danger I see is we end up with an even-more totally bipartisan system like the US has, which I firmly believe is terrible and responsible for a lot of their problems.

Regardless of what you think about the Carbon Tax, it is undeniable that the Greens have had a major shake-up effect on politics in the country because of their being voted in. And (again regardless of whether the Carbon Tax is good or bad) I think that has really been awesome for the public in general because it has served as a good reminder that we are NOT beholden to a two party system and that voting for a third party can have an effect on your life in this country.

I basically agree with Toll; I want a third party to come along that isn't as extremist as the Greens and some of the other ones and find it weird that all the other parties are just variations of that (ie, basically one-policy parties).

I will not vote Labor in the next election because I basically disagree with everything they do. If this article from the OP turns out to be true, that alone would be enough for me to not vote Liberal.

I will certainly be looking at all the other candidates - including the Greens! - because now I know if they get enough support, maybe they can get in place and Get Shit Done that I think is awesome.
12:55pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Hogfather
Cairns, Queensland
11264 posts
Aside from?

There are 150 seats in the Lower House, the Greens have one. I think that's more than enough, don't you? I shudder to think what sort of radical, 12 directions at once policy they'd implement with an upper and lower house majority.

Do you think we should shut down the coal and uranium industries altogether? What about other mining? From what I can see, now that they have some clout that seems to be their stated objective?
I will certainly be looking at all the other candidates - including the Greens! - because now I know if they get enough support, maybe they can get in place and Get Shit Done that I think is awesome.

What shit from their 2010 policy platform do you want them to do, exactly, and how much tax are you willing to pay for it (or what services should be cut?)

Remember that the tax base will also be a lot lower as we'll be removing lots of industries.
12:59pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Raven
Melbourne, Victoria
6157 posts
I basically agree with Toll; I want a third party to come along that isn't as extremist as the Greens and some of the other ones and find it weird that all the other parties are just variations of that (ie, basically one-policy parties).

The amount of money required to get another party up and running in the same kind of strength is ridiculous. Just look at both the Green or the Democrats 8-12 years ago. Sure, people know they're there, but there's no way they could operate in the four year lead-up to an election enough to field enough actual, relevant candidates that people hear from to get that many seats.

The Secular Party are an example of this. You don't find them sitting in the middle, or having the same position as one or another on all issues - they sit on polar opposites for different issues, yet the general public are more interested in voting for a Sex Party which is about as close to being a serious candidate as Stephen Colbert running for US President.
Yet in my electorate, from memory five times as many people voted for Family First candidates than SPA candidates!

Unless someone's got a good $80m to bankroll a new party for four years before they get elected, it's not going to happen.

last edited by Raven at 13:06:16 16/Nov/11
01:03pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Scooter
Brisbane, Queensland
5123 posts
I can certainly understand the want to vote for something 'Different' because you think that the current 2 parties are bad...
But why would you want to vote for something worse just because it's different?

I always check out any Indie in my area (and encourage you to do the same) but a quick look at the balance and fact sheet for the Greens should stop any sane person shooting a vote their way. Even if just to shake things up.
01:16pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Rawprawn
Brisbane, Queensland
111 posts
I voted for the Greens in the last election basically on account of my dislike for the two major parties at the time. But I'm seriously considering voting for them again. They seem to be one of the few parties about these days that dream big. 100% renewable energy, high speed rail connecting the country. These sound like good things to me! Big and expensive initially yes, but they sound like good ideas that would produce benefits for many years to come if they came to fruition. I also dig their whole thing about processing asylum seekers on shore. Apparently less expensive, and seems to make more sense if they were ever to be integrated into the community.

I like the fact that they have mixed up federal politics, as it was becoming increasingly difficult to determine the difference between labor and the liberal/nationals at the federal level. And who knows? Maybe come the next federal election the two will have learned something during the time of minority government and construct policy that'll win people back.
01:16pm 16/11/11 Permalink
greazy
Brisbane, Queensland
5095 posts
Can't see anything on shutting down uranium mining on the link you posted hogfather but googling gets me this link http://greens.org.au/policies/climate-change-and-energy/nuclear

One of the most retarded things they have on that list is #22 removing ionising radiation on food. Hahaha. Good luck getting anything imported into Australia then.

The Greens, as a whole, are retarded for sure but if their popularity increases then maybe the other parties get a wake up call and stop being equally retarded or they might mellow out and become more conservative and less extreme.
01:17pm 16/11/11 Permalink
paveway
Brisbane, Queensland
15648 posts
i think you'll find the greens will be back out on their ass this next election, regardless of who else gets the rest

still have to laugh at the fucking knob bob brown carrying on about some rare whale that was born on the same day that they won that seat as if it was some sign

hopefully it gets harpooned by a jap whaling boat next election

last edited by paveway at 13:24:40 16/Nov/11
01:22pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Raven
Melbourne, Victoria
6158 posts
I tend to agree. People saw bringing in the Greens as their voice of being more environmentally friendly decisions. Instead they've done nothing to help in that area except introduce an unpopular carbon tax.
01:24pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Hogfather
Cairns, Queensland
11265 posts
greazy, from your link:

The Australian Greens will:
end the exploration for, and the mining and export of, uranium.
01:26pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Rawprawn
Brisbane, Queensland
112 posts
haha I didn't hear Bob say that. Pretty sure he's an atheist though, so it was probably tongue in cheek.
I'm not a subscriber to all of his policies, but I think he's a pretty smart guy. Knob doesn't come to mind :o
01:27pm 16/11/11 Permalink
spoon
Brisbane, Queensland
411 posts
People saw bringing in the Greens as their voice of being more environmentally friendly decisions. Instead they've done nothing to help in that area except introduce an unpopular carbon tax.


I want to help save the environment...aslong as it doesn't affect me in any way.

01:27pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Hogfather
Cairns, Queensland
11266 posts
I want to help save the environment...aslong as it doesn't affect me in any way.

How does taxing a relatively inelastic commodity save the environment again?
01:30pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Scooter
Brisbane, Queensland
5124 posts
Rawprawn, you voted for them because they dream big?
Thats great, dreams are awesome to have. Unfortunatly we all have to live in reality though. If you looked into how they want/plan to achieve those dreams you might be in for a quite severe wake up shock.


100% renewable power? Tell em he's dreaming... but we already knew that.
I don't think you understand quire how big and espensive a national High-Speed Rail would be to setup either. You might think the NBN is huge, but thats just penuts compared to rail. We also dont have the population density to make it even remotely viable.

Asylum seekers seems to be something they're not completly retarded about. However, as I've said before, they are such a small minute issue that they shouldn't be given anywhere near the amount of press they get... for any party.
01:39pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Raider
Brisbane, Queensland
3744 posts
Sigh i'm getting really sick of people and them trying to fucking force religion down the regular populace.
01:46pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Hogfather
Cairns, Queensland
11267 posts
That's what freaks me out the most Scooter.

They have a current policy platform of HSR, 100% renewable energy, eradication of poverty, increase spending on health and destroy the private health industry, higher government contribution to child care, more foreign aid, less industry ... all at once.

And they might be serious ><

Oh, I just found out where its coming from. More taxes for the 'rich'.
Taxation

reduce inequities in the current personal tax system by:
reducing tax breaks for high income earners;
removing Fringe Benefits Tax concessions which promote increased use of motor vehicles;
removing the concessional arrangements for Capital Gains Tax;
only allowing losses from an investment to be offset against income from the same investment;
abolishing the 30% Private Health Insurance Rebate in order to increase funding for public hospitals;
taxing family trusts in the same way as companies;
eliminating high rates of effective marginal taxation for those on welfare benefits; and
introduce a new top marginal tax rate of 50 per cent on incomes of $1 million or over.
introduce an estate tax with full provisions to protect the family farm, the family home and small business with a threshold of $5 million as indexed from the year 2010.
conduct an inquiry with a view to implementing changes to the tax system that address the negative impacts of the GST on:
income distribution;
environmental sustainability; and
business administration costs.
oppose any increase or extension to the GST.
implement a gradual and long term shift in the tax system from work based taxes to taxes on natural resources and pollution including:
a carbon tax levied on generators of mains-supplied electricity or gas
a national carbon trading scheme; and
other ecological taxes and charges at a level sufficient enough that their prices reflect the full environmental cost of their production, use or disposal.
introduce a system of minimum personal and corporate tax legislation to reduce the opportunities for individuals and companies to use loopholes to minimise their tax obligations.
conduct a full review of the superannuation system with the aim of reducing its complexity and establishing progressive rates of superannuation taxation.
return the company tax rate to 33% and broaden the company tax base by reducing tax concessions.
limit tax deductibility for salaries & salary-related expenses for any individual employee to $1million per year.
end subsidies and tax concessions to environmentally harmful industries.


http://greens.org.au/policies/sustainable-economy/economics
This is why the Greens are a BAD FUCKING IDEA! :)
01:46pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Spook
Brisbane, Queensland
33490 posts
signing in to laugh at bruce flegg and any party he is associated with.

what a massive failure on every level.

spewin, i was gonna do a market research tonite on state politics.

man was i gonna unload on L(OSER)NP.

unfortunately i had to play cricket instead :(

also, good to see the LNP still wants to lose the next election.
01:50pm 16/11/11 Permalink
trog
AGN Admin
Brisbane, Queensland
35064 posts
But why would you want to vote for something worse just because it's different?
Worse is a subjective argument though; there's plenty of greenie hippy people that think they're not worse. The main reason I voted for them in the last election was because I thought they were big enough to actually get some seats and make some waves. So I got what I wanted in that regard.

I don't like a lot of their policies though and I probably won't vote for them again. I am just saying, regardless of what you think about the Carbon Tax and what effect it might have or not have, the Greens getting in has been disruptive to the status quo and I think that has been a good thing.
01:54pm 16/11/11 Permalink
taggs
5751 posts
the Greens getting in has been disruptive to the status quo and I think that has been a good thing.


i have to disagree.

this current parliament has been the most dysfunctional and ineffective of any i have lived under. if that is the disruption you were looking for i'll take the old status quo back thanks.
01:56pm 16/11/11 Permalink
trog
AGN Admin
Brisbane, Queensland
35065 posts
i have to disagree.

this current parliament has been the most dysfunctional and ineffective of any i have lived under. if that is the disruption you were looking for i'll take the old status quo back thanks.
isn't that just part of having a Labor government though ? :)
01:57pm 16/11/11 Permalink
spoon
Brisbane, Queensland
412 posts
How does taxing a relatively inelastic commodity save the environment again?


I believe it has the potential to reduce green house gas emissions.

Asylum seekers seems to be something they're not completly retarded about. However, as I've said before, they are such a small minute issue that they shouldn't be given anywhere near the amount of press they get... for any party.


I agree, human rights is really a non-issue in todays fast moving political climate.

... all at once.


I thought they just proposed a 12 month study as to the viability of a HSR network on the east coast? I guess that's what freaks me out the most, they actually want to do a concept study.

Oh, I just found out where its coming from. More taxes for the 'rich'.

Don't these green bastards realise if we tax the rich they'll just pack up and LEAVE. It's as if these guys are talking to a generation which has spawned countless protests in favor of wealth equality.
01:59pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Jc_23
Brisbane, Queensland
91 posts
because there's all different levels of 'happy if someone did that to you' from person to person - it's not an adequate or consistent measure of whether or not to do something


Exactly! Just ask Rihanna, if she had her way everybody would be running around forcing alcohol down each others throats at pace topless chaining and whipping the crap out of each other and trading heavy blows with Afro-American men while other people shine lights onto them and watch through the door! We can't tolerate that sort of behaviour, surely!?!? :)

02:00pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Scooter
Brisbane, Queensland
5125 posts
there's plenty of greenie hippy people that think they're not worse.


Hence why I quantified it with 'sane.'
02:01pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Tiny
Brisbane, Queensland
2982 posts
I don't like a lot of their policies though and I probably won't vote for them again. I am just saying, regardless of what you think about the Carbon Tax and what effect it might have or not have, the Greens getting in has been disruptive to the status quo and I think that has been a good thing.


I guess that all comes down to whether or not you think the disruption has had a positive or negative outcome. The carbon tax is after all in the end just another tax. I still think regardless of what happens from now until the next federal election, you won't see labor winning. Too many people , including myself are upset we have been forced something we didn't want and certainly didn't vote for. The liberal party may not be fit to lead but I sure as hell am not voting for a party that let the greens have a say in what this country needs and doesn't need.
02:02pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Hogfather
Cairns, Queensland
11268 posts
I believe it has the potential to reduce green house gas emissions.

All by themselves energy prices have increased markedly in the last 30-40 years and yet here we are in 2011 looking at what are very mild price signals to force change?

If the 70s oil shock couldn't get the world off oil's tit then then the 20 bucks a tonne or whatever it is has absolutely no fucking hope whatsoever. You can write that shit on stone tablets and preach it from the mountain top matey :)
02:03pm 16/11/11 Permalink
greazy
Brisbane, Queensland
5096 posts
Yeah hogfather I was agreeing with you, just pointing out that the link you provided didn;t have no uranium.
02:03pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Hogfather
Cairns, Queensland
11269 posts
Oh sorry!
02:04pm 16/11/11 Permalink
HurricaneJim
Brisbane, Queensland
924 posts
What? I did answer the question.

Somehow with a single seat they were able to implement the biggest change to tax policy since the GST, all without having to ask those pesky voters what they think about it.


I don't like a lot of their policies though and I probably won't vote for them again. I am just saying, regardless of what you think about the Carbon Tax and what effect it might have or not have, the Greens getting in has been disruptive to the status quo and I think that has been a good thing.


It's not a Carbon tax it a price on carbon emissions.

Now neither the Labor or Lib/NP were elected so any promises are null and void. Labor MINORITY Govt means they have to accommodate those who put them there. If this means the indies and greens then so be it. Tony Maggot has been throwing a hissy fit since the election because he wouldn't accept what the indies and greens wanted.

Just to make my point absolutely clear, the are all unrepresentative swill.
02:05pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Rawprawn
Brisbane, Queensland
113 posts
True scooter, the whole 100% renewable energy bizzo is probably a bit of a pipe dream, and seems to be something they're pretty committed to. But from the looks of the PDF related to the HSR, they want a 12 month study done before locking us into anything. Last one was done in 2001 apparently, so maybe it's time for another one?
I like trains!

A lot of what is in that article about their tax policy that you have quoted there Hog seems to be fairly reasonable to me. My mum has some communist leanings though, and this has undoubtedly coloured my view on politics. haha
02:06pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Hogfather
Cairns, Queensland
11270 posts
A lot of what is in that article about their tax policy that you have quoted there Hog seems to be fairly reasonable to me. My mum has some communist leanings though, and this has undoubtedly coloured my view on politics. haha

Fuckin reds!
02:10pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Tiny
Brisbane, Queensland
2983 posts
The funny part I find about socialists in this country is most of them are career students who have never worked a day in there life. They are all to busy planning protests and occupying places to actually contribute to the economy they all so drastically want to change.
02:13pm 16/11/11 Permalink
fade
Brisbane, Queensland
7095 posts

I believe it has the potential to reduce green house gas emissions.

Believe? There's that green gaia religion rearing its ugly head again.
02:14pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Rawprawn
Brisbane, Queensland
114 posts
yeah, she's pretty red.
After a fair few wines at a family dinner, she expressed interest in the idea that a "benevolent father figure" in place of democratically elected officials might be a better option. All said after quite a few wines like I said though. She's sane and intelligent most of the time haha
02:18pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Tiny
Brisbane, Queensland
2984 posts
"benevolent father figure"



02:21pm 16/11/11 Permalink
orbitor
Brisbane, Queensland
8711 posts
Why do ethics need to be any more complicated than "Would you be happier if someone did that to you? If not, then don't fucking do it!"


Cause you might enjoy golden showers, but who's to say I do?
02:22pm 16/11/11 Permalink
deadlyf
Queensland
2216 posts
Trog I could rant about all the shit members of the Greens party have put my community through like shutting down a road resurfacing half way through to get an environmental impact study (on a fucking RESURFACE) so we were left with mud roads for 6 months and they didn't have the money left to do a proper job in repairing the roads when they finally were allowed to complete it or spending $40 million dollars of tax payer money buying up businesses in the area and shutting them down and leaving the buildings to rot.

But because these aren't policies that have been passed in Government and simply a case of the Greens using their leverage with Labor to get what they want when they want it I'm not sure you will care. The Greens view the environment as a religion, if they feel something is environmentally friendly or unfriendly that is all they need. Facts just get in the way of hugging trees and being at one with nature.
02:23pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Rawprawn
Brisbane, Queensland
115 posts
haha Tiny. She's probably more of a Lenin kinda gal.
02:23pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Hogfather
Cairns, Queensland
11271 posts


Nazis are fascist not Communist anyway ...
02:23pm 16/11/11 Permalink
spoon
Brisbane, Queensland
413 posts
All by themselves energy prices have increased markedly in the last 30-40 years and yet here we are in 2011 looking at what are very mild price signals to force change? If the 70s oil shock couldn't get the world off oil's tit then then the 20 bucks a tonne or whatever it is has absolutely no fucking hope whatsoever. You can write that shit on stone tablets and preach it from the mountain top matey :)


We're not just talking about oil but otherwise a brilliant post and I agree 100% that a price on carbon emissions will not drive us in search of alternative energies such as solar,wind, nuclear fission/fusion. It just doesn't make sense for companies to produce solar panels and turbines when no one wants them and I can assure you the day we see panels on top of houses or farms of turbines I will eat my words.

The funny part I find about socialists in this country is most of them are career students who have never worked a day in there life. They are all to busy planning protests and occupying places to actually contribute to the economy they all so drastically want to change.


HA HA I find that funny too! Sure it's anecdotal and completely false but good humour is good humour.

Believe? There's that green gaia religion rearing its ugly head again.


YES! Science is a religion haha well done!

Trog I could rant about all the shit members of the Greens party have put my community through like shutting down a road resurfacing half way through to get an environmental impact study (on a fucking RESURFACE) so we were left with mud roads for 6 months and they didn't have the money left to do a proper job in repairing the roads when they finally were allowed to complete it or spending $40 million dollars of tax payer money buying up businesses in the area and shutting them down and leaving the buildings to rot.


Yes you could rant and rave. I'd believe it.
02:29pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Rawprawn
Brisbane, Queensland
116 posts


post partially because im not totally sure how to do the image thingo. hopefully it works D:

EDIT: forgot the end quote!
02:32pm 16/11/11 Permalink
carson
Gippsland, Victoria
1349 posts
State based religion is the worst fucking idea ever. I'm surprised you guys are getting more upset over the possibility of the greens getting more power rather than the possiblity of this stupid bullshit program like this that would serve to indoctrinate your kiddies.

Secular ethics classes or bust.


These guys were atheists in that they didn't believe in a god, but they did create massive cults of personalities and removed freedom of religion and expression.
02:37pm 16/11/11 Permalink
fpot
Gold Coast, Queensland
20186 posts
I've always thought that the carbon tax is 'yet another tax hike' which is kind of neccessary because of how the economy is - the gubbernment need the cash. They've just dressed it with some fancy save the envrionment spin because if they just said 'we are gonna tax you more because we have to' people would get upset.
02:41pm 16/11/11 Permalink
trog
AGN Admin
Brisbane, Queensland
35066 posts
Trog I could rant about all the shit members of the Greens party have put my community through like shutting down a road resurfacing half way through to get an environmental impact study (on a fucking RESURFACE) so we were left with mud roads for 6 months and they didn't have the money left to do a proper job in repairing the roads when they finally were allowed to complete it or spending $40 million dollars of tax payer money buying up businesses in the area and shutting them down and leaving the buildings to rot.

But because these aren't policies that have been passed in Government and simply a case of the Greens using their leverage with Labor to get what they want when they want it I'm not sure you will care. The Greens view the environment as a religion, if they feel something is environmentally friendly or unfriendly that is all they need. Facts just get in the way of hugging trees and being at one with nature.
how did they put that through your community?

I repeat, I'm not in love with the Greens or their policies. That sort of stuff sounds retarded, like a lot of their other policies. If you read my posts you would see that I would care about examples like that because it is exactly what I'm asking for.
02:42pm 16/11/11 Permalink
paveway
Brisbane, Queensland
15649 posts
How does taxing a relatively inelastic commodity save the environment again?



I believe it has the potential to reduce green house gas emissions.


haha DERP
02:46pm 16/11/11 Permalink
spoon
Brisbane, Queensland
414 posts
haha DERP


LOL! (Laughing Out Loud)
02:49pm 16/11/11 Permalink
deadlyf
Queensland
2217 posts
how did they put that through your community?
You mean how are they responsible? At a federal level maybe not at all but it was a member of a Greens based group called Gecko that put a stop to the road works because they saw surveyor pegs on the side of the road and assumed they were going to widen the road rather than just resurface it like they had been contracted to. The pegs are off to the side obviously so they don't get in the way during work but that doesn't stop them from using their influence at DERM to shut down work until an environmental impact study has been done. The study obviously didn't take very long despite these things still being quite expensive but it was a month or so before they actually started the study and by then we were in the middle of some wet weather that delayed it even further.

http://gecko.org.au/campaigns/springbrook/

They live in their own little world, they don't want tourism in the area so they lobby the council and state government whenever a proposal for road upgrades is brought up so we have pot hole covered roads that are becoming more and more dangerous to drive on. It doesn't stop the tourist buses from operating either, it just makes it more dangerous for them to do so. Only a handful of members actually live in the area, most live on the Coast.
03:19pm 16/11/11 Permalink
trog
AGN Admin
Brisbane, Queensland
35067 posts
They don't seem to be related to "The Greens" at all though. They just look like a bunch of eco-warriors, from a quick skim of their website?
03:25pm 16/11/11 Permalink
spoon
Brisbane, Queensland
415 posts
You mean how are they responsible? At a federal level maybe not at all


So basically not at all.
03:25pm 16/11/11 Permalink
deadlyf
Queensland
2218 posts
They don't seem to be related to "The Greens" at all though. They just look like a bunch of eco-warriors, from a quick skim of their website?
They are supported by and support the Greens, their members are handing out flyers for the Greens during voting, i.e. they are also Greens party members. Not sure who you think the Greens party is made up of if not people like this.
03:40pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Tiny
Brisbane, Queensland
2985 posts
I'm just curious why you would vote for a party that you don't agree on policy with.
03:44pm 16/11/11 Permalink
spoon
Brisbane, Queensland
416 posts
They are supported by and support the Greens, their members are handing out flyers for the Greens during voting, i.e. they are also Greens party members. Not sure who you think the Greens party is made up of if not people like this.



Also some Gecko's are green in colour. The Greens are in-fact some sort of lizard master race IT ALL MAKES SENSE!
03:46pm 16/11/11 Permalink
infi
Brisbane, Queensland
17951 posts
I dont want religion near my kids. I went to a Catholic school for 12 years and whilst it was a pleasant enough experience, I don't see why religiojn is needed in order to instill respect, diligence and discipline into kids.
03:48pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Hogfather
Cairns, Queensland
11272 posts
I'm just curious why you would vote for a party that you don't agree on policy with.

Its all about the ripples.
03:54pm 16/11/11 Permalink
infi
Brisbane, Queensland
17952 posts
Also voting for the Greens to advocate change from a two party system is irresponsible. Trog you ouught to know better.

The Greens have no capacity to govern in a mainstream sense. They are a narrow view party, and all of their policies sound like they belong in the Socialist Alliance for the University Union elections.

They are not a real party based on the needs of real tax paying voters. They are more interested in pursuing utopian fantasies to be paid for by the super rich capitalists.

The Greens have no real understanding of how an ecnomy works.
04:10pm 16/11/11 Permalink
trog
AGN Admin
Brisbane, Queensland
35068 posts
Also voting for the Greens to advocate change from a two party system is irresponsible. Trog you ouught to know better.
I think its more irresponsible to vote blindly for one of those two parties. I've outlined the reasons why I did that; I agree with all your other points so.. there we are.

Also fuck you Obes for making two typos in the subject
04:25pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Raven
Melbourne, Victoria
6159 posts
I think it's irresponsible to blindly vote for any party.
Too often we see this - people would have NO idea what their local candidate stands for, hell, often even who their local candidate is - but they just see 'Labour' or 'Liberal' and put a number in the box that has the party next to it. It's screwed.
04:27pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Obes
Brisbane, Queensland
9446 posts
Also fuck you Obes for making two typos in the subject

Spelling isn't real trog.

It's something "society" invented about 300 years ago, and it changes based on time and location.

So what is a typo today here, may not be a typo tomorrow in another place!

I posted this here, because so many of you are rabid atheists but humourously are right wing voters and will vote LNP because that's what you do, despite them pushing the god agenda.

Seriously The Sex Party seems like a sensible choice these days.
04:37pm 16/11/11 Permalink
trog
AGN Admin
Brisbane, Queensland
35069 posts
I think it's irresponsible to blindly vote for any party.
mos def!

I am looking to spend some time working on http://trog.qgl.org/voteomatic before the next election to try to cover a bunch of feedback/suggestions that came out of the last one. I think informing citizens and making them aware of exactly how much of their political views actually conflicts or is not supported by the party they usually vote for is probably something worth doing.
05:30pm 16/11/11 Permalink
fade
Brisbane, Queensland
7096 posts
mos def!

I am looking to spend some time working on http://trog.qgl.org/voteomatic before the next election to try to cover a bunch of feedback/suggestions that came out of the last one. I think informing citizens and making them aware of exactly how much of their political views actually conflicts or is not supported by the party they usually vote for is probably something worth doing.

As to your voteomatic, you should also give weighting to categories or individual issues.

For example, I support DST. But it of little importance to me as opposed to, say, tax reform or fiscal discipline.

edit: i realise that it is a hobby and you probably couldn't be fucked. But without weighting its utility is zero to none.
05:36pm 16/11/11 Permalink
trog
AGN Admin
Brisbane, Queensland
35070 posts
On an unrelated note but just speaking of how awesome Liberals are, I just heard on the radio that back in 2007, apparently John Howard said to Channel 9:
"If I was running al-Qaeda in Iraq, I would put a circle around March 2008, and pray, as many times as possible, for a victory not only for Obama, but also for the Democrats."
haha, so wrong
05:39pm 16/11/11 Permalink
trog
AGN Admin
Brisbane, Queensland
35071 posts
As to your voteomatic, you should also give weighting to categories or individual issues.
Yeh, weighting complicates things a lot. Not so much technically, but in terms of figuring out how people think about this stuff. I will try a few things though.

What I am leaning towards is a system where you can pick a few things that are "dealbreakers" - i.e., if Carbon Tax was something that would stop you voting for Labor, then you would rate that as a dealbreaker and it would hard-exclude Labor regardless of other preferences. And then maybe on top of that, strongly support, support, don't support, strongly don't support sort of options. Once the basics are in it will be easy to tweak. edit: he said, hopefully
05:41pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Hogfather
Cairns, Queensland
11276 posts
Well you could ask the user to indicate how serious they consider the issue as the weight by describing the options:
1 - Strongly Disagree. This issue is very important in my choice of candidate.
2 - Disagree: This issue is important to me.
3 - Ambivalent: Do not care enough for the issue to have impact on my decision.
4 - Agree: This issue is important to me.
5 - Strongly Agree: This issue is very important in my choice of candidate.

And weight the response accordingly.

I'd avoid 'deal breakers' as it would be far too easy to come back with a 'no party or candidate suits your views lol democracy is unrepresentative' kind of response.
05:49pm 16/11/11 Permalink
FaceMan
Brisbane, Queensland
7581 posts
Does the Sex Party support getting rid of Mandatory Voting ?
I know Julie Bishop of the Liberals does.


06:07pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Nathan
Brisbane, Queensland
3844 posts
this current parliament has been the most dysfunctional and ineffective of any i have lived under.


They have been no better or worse than any I have lived under. Most passed bills I dont give a shit about either way, some I like, some I dislike. Given how centrist both major parties in our country are, its hard to imagine any other outcome.
06:18pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Scooter
Brisbane, Queensland
5130 posts
Could have a simple policy support / don't support followed by a 1-10 rating for care factor?
So if you support but it's a care factor of 1 it gives 1 point, but care factor of 10 gives 10 points. And -1 to -10 for don't support.
06:33pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Tiny
Brisbane, Queensland
2986 posts
John Howard is a saint, leave him out of this!
06:35pm 16/11/11 Permalink
lateral
Brisbane, Queensland
4018 posts
Does the Sex Party support getting rid of Mandatory Voting ?
I know Julie Bishop of the Liberals does.

I wonder if the distribution of votes would change?

Firing straight from the hip here, but wouldn't it encourage a bipartisan system? as those who are disenfranchised would just opt not to vote instead of giving a 3rd party an opportunity to gain ground with good policy?

"If I was running al-Qaeda in Iraq, I would put a circle around March 2008, and pray, as many times as possible, for a victory not only for Obama, but also for the Democrats."


It was the ultimate suicide attack! Deliberately killed by foreign assassination squad in an attempt to create political volatility? genius... or madness!

I posted this here, because so many of you are rabid atheists but humourously are right wing voters
not to mention free market ideologists with undertones of social extremism..

Seriously The Sex Party seems like a sensible choice these days.

we need a pirate party, not so much for "free downloads for everyone", but more for their liberal policies in direct contrast to the conservative norm here.

07:22pm 16/11/11 Permalink
trog
AGN Admin
Brisbane, Queensland
35073 posts
we already have a pirate party - http://www.pirateparty.org.au/
07:25pm 16/11/11 Permalink
Rawprawn
Brisbane, Queensland
117 posts
I made the mistake of mentioning this in a family round table discussion, and it turns out my mum likes Trog! I suppose he enjoys Lenin doctrine too! Or at least I'd say that If i was in was in Tony Abott's front bench. Their whole political strategy seems to centre around picking out a few points and dismantling them. I'm all for debate, but there comes a point where it turns and is no longer constructive. This sort of thing has brought down politics to a dangerously American level in Australia.

Lourie Oaks was on Big Ideas (or maybe it was an airing of a national press conference) a few nights ago, and brought up the whole concept of people viewing politicians very poorly these days. I would agree that it is very difficult to view any politician in a positive light these days on account of the hamster wheel. The apparent need to have whatever a politician says scrutinized instantly, but at the same time, with meaningful comments. I'm not sure this can work!
01:21am 17/11/11 Permalink
Fireman Sam
Brisbane, Queensland
94 posts
Wasn't it Bruce Flegg a few months ago that said he was horrified at kids being brainwashed about climate change in schools?

Oh wait it was Bruce McIver http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/environment/students-brainwashed-over-climate-change-lnp-20110715-1hh8d.html

While I am a member of the greens I tend to be against "team politics". Where you blindly believe that everything your team does is right and everything the other team does is wrong. I don't agree with everything the greens do and can often agree with things both of the other parties do or have done. I do tend to agree with most green policies but I guess I joined more for an overarching philosophy rather than cherry picking individual policies.

That said there is a lot of talk in this thread where perception doesn't equal reality. I do want to counter a couple of those, particularly the more exaggerated ones.

deadlyf -
Unfortunately the damage is usually done by Greens policies in regional areas they don't vote Greens anyway. Meanwhile in inner city suburbs we still have a large number of fuckwits that think a vote for the Greens is a vote for the environment.


The first greens bill to be passed in parliament ever only occurred one month ago. This bill was to stop an individual federal minister having veto rights over legislation passed in either NT or ACT. Not exactly destroying the bush. As nothing else has been passed the greens haven't had any impact at all. I would love to hear some evidence of this damage

Hogfather- The carbon tax is virtually identical to what was proposed earlier by labor but the amendments allow for a lot more flexibility in the upper targets of pollution reduction and increased support for research. This was the same policy that almost 50% of the liberal party supported if you take the vote of how Abbott came to power. Not exactly economy destroying stuff.

Infi- Surprisingly enough there are actually economists and business people in the greens, I know it may come as a shock to you but it's true.


No one in any party is out to destroy Australia and destroy the way we live. They all want what is best for the country they just have slightly different methods on how to get there.
08:32am 17/11/11 Permalink
trog
AGN Admin
Brisbane, Queensland
35075 posts
I made the mistake of mentioning this in a family round table discussion, and it turns out my mum likes Trog! I suppose he enjoys Lenin doctrine too! Or at least I'd say that If i was in was in Tony Abott's front bench. Their whole political strategy seems to centre around picking out a few points and dismantling them. I'm all for debate, but there comes a point where it turns and is no longer constructive. This sort of thing has brought down politics to a dangerously American level in Australia.
I get that a lot with yo mommas... but I don't understand what she likes about me because the next thing you're saying seems to be pro-Liberal, which I most defnitely am not
09:29am 17/11/11 Permalink
fpot
Gold Coast, Queensland
20191 posts
No one in any party is out to destroy Australia and destroy the way we live.
Except of course, the family first party.
12:14pm 17/11/11 Permalink
FaceMan
Brisbane, Queensland
7586 posts
From Fireman Sams link:
http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/environment/students-brainwashed-over-climate-change-lnp-20110715-1hh8d.html

"We were shocked at the way the climate change debate on one side is being pushed in the classroom," he said.

"And not balanced perspectively. Our kids are being brainwashed under this Labor education system."

Mr McIver's comments received loud applause from more than 700 delegates from throughout the state.

"Why aren't they being told that if you go to Quilpie and you drive to Windorah - [Liberal National Party MPs] Vaughan Johnson's country, Howard Hobbs' country - you will see these sand hills that have been blown up years ago," he said.

"When the droughts were much bigger than the ones we have just had.

"And why aren't we being told that Brisbane has had floods in the 1890s of over eight metres.

"[LNP leader] Campbell [Newman] tells me that back in the 1820s - even before white man even came here - there were floods that could have been over 12 metres at the post office at the bottom of Elizabeth Street.

"So, things change. Climate is constantly changing. Is man having an effect? Well I will leave it for you to judge."


Read more: http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/environment/students-brainwashed-over-climate-change-lnp-20110715-1hh8d.html#ixzz1dvEQlMX3


Fireman Sam what part of that do you disagree with ?

Theres a 9yrold girl a few doors up from me that doesnt believe in God, Santa, The Easter Bunny, but is convinced Climate Change is wreaking havoc on the Planet caused by Man.

Schools are not teaching Critical Thinking they are Preaching Political views disguised as Science.
The Left are rewriting history.
Thats just as bad as the Religious Right doing it.

last edited by FaceMan at 12:42:03 17/Nov/11
12:40pm 17/11/11 Permalink
fpot
Gold Coast, Queensland
20192 posts
Schools are not teaching Critical Thinking they are Preaching Political views disguised as Science.
What do you know about critical thinking? Your posts are a laundry list of logical fallacies.

Theres a 9yrold girl a few doors up from me that doesnt believe in God, Santa, The Easter Bunny, but is convinced Climate Change is wreaking havoc on the Planet caused by Man.
While 'wreaking havoc' is the sort of hyperbole you'd expect from a 9 year old, she is right, and it is only internet conspiracy losers like you and dazed who would think there is something wrong with her thinking.

edit: in fact you have in inadvertently revealed that a 9 year old girl is smarter and more world aware than you are.


last edited by fpot at 13:30:48 17/Nov/11
01:28pm 17/11/11 Permalink
paveway
Brisbane, Queensland
15651 posts
still amazed fpot is completely consumed by climate change theories
01:31pm 17/11/11 Permalink
fpot
Gold Coast, Queensland
20193 posts
I think you have me mixed up with nerf. I don't think I have ever given more than a four line reply to these gronks.
01:32pm 17/11/11 Permalink
FaceMan
Brisbane, Queensland
7587 posts
Can you name an event on the Planet linked to Man Made Global Warming fpot ?

How about something simpler, can you provide some evidence that proves what McIver said is wrong ?



last edited by FaceMan at 13:49:02 17/Nov/11
01:46pm 17/11/11 Permalink
Hogfather
Cairns, Queensland
11280 posts
Hogfather- The carbon tax is virtually identical to what was proposed earlier by labor but the amendments allow for a lot more flexibility in the upper targets of pollution reduction and increased support for research. This was the same policy that almost 50% of the liberal party supported if you take the vote of how Abbott came to power. Not exactly economy destroying stuff.

If its such popular policy why didn't the ALP take it to the polls? I think the tax is pointless but (pun intended) that's not the point.

The ALP will hopefully be pummelled into Opposition over the lack of respect shown to the electorate so that politicians of all persuasions get a wake up call about the will of the people.
01:47pm 17/11/11 Permalink
FaceMan
Brisbane, Queensland
7588 posts
Had to laugh at Obama talking about "Climate Change" his plan is almost identical to Tony Abbotts Direct Action.

Gillard was embarassing from what i saw.
She 'fawns' over people. She is not a Leader.
Theres no commanding of respect.

02:46pm 17/11/11 Permalink
Obes
Brisbane, Queensland
9447 posts
Had to laugh at Obama talking about "Climate Change" his plan is almost identical to Tony Abbotts Direct Action.

As long as you laughed when you realized, that the Carbon Tax is what Tony Abbott wanted 3 years ago ? ... It's a little hard to tell what Tony actually believes in.
03:08pm 17/11/11 Permalink
Hogfather
Cairns, Queensland
11282 posts
Its not hard to tell what Obes believes in though.
03:16pm 17/11/11 Permalink
Obes
Brisbane, Queensland
9448 posts
lol hogfather ... last time you told someone what I was doing, you got the game wrong and the people I was playing with wrong.

But keep on trucking.
03:23pm 17/11/11 Permalink
Hogfather
Cairns, Queensland
11283 posts
Speak in riddles much there Obes?

Its pretty clear imo that you believe in the ALP like the second coming. You're the bizarro world infi.
03:24pm 17/11/11 Permalink
Obes
Brisbane, Queensland
9449 posts
Worng again...
Tho I suppose from your view on the right me sitting in the middle voting for no one might appear like labor.
03:52pm 17/11/11 Permalink
Hogfather
Cairns, Queensland
11284 posts
When was the last time you voted for the coalition federally?

I voted for Rudd's Government, and Keating's a couple of times (yeh I'm old, fuck you guys). Actually only once, although I would have voted for the Hawke / Keating Governments if I was old enough in their earlier terms.
03:58pm 17/11/11 Permalink
simul
Brisbane, Queensland
1241 posts
As long as you laughed when you realized, that the Carbon Tax is what Tony Abbott wanted 3 years ago ? ... It's a little hard to tell what Tony actually believes in.


Whatever the catholic church tells him to it seems.
04:17pm 17/11/11 Permalink
simul
Brisbane, Queensland
1242 posts
PS:

The Commonwealth shall not make any law for establishing any religion, or for imposing any religious observance, or for prohibiting the free exercise of any religion, and no religious test shall be required as a qualification for any office or public trust under the Commonwealth.


http://www.aph.gov.au/senate/general/constitution/chapter5.htm
04:21pm 17/11/11 Permalink
Obes
Brisbane, Queensland
9450 posts
When was the last time you voted for the coalition federally?

So if you vote for any one other then the coalition you are a labor voter ?

We are currently finding out more about you than me.

To answer you question, neither major party has gotten my first vote in a long time. TBH I am not even sure who I voted for last time, because they have faded off into obscurity. I do remember not having much choice, because I didn't and won't vote for family first (or any party headed up by Pauline Hanson).
I did use to vote democrats until Kernot defected. Then voted for them again when StottDespoja was leader. I'd vote for the LDP if there was a candidate in Lilley but there probably won't be.

I voted for Rudd's Government, and Keating a couple of times

Sure you did (it sounds a bit like when a racist uses some of my friends have dark skin as a defence) ... but beyond that Relavence ?

I used to like drinking XXXX. Now I like drinking Asahi.
04:26pm 17/11/11 Permalink
taggs
5758 posts
I'd vote for the LDP if there was a candidate in Lilley but there probably won't be.


seriously?! fuck yeah, go obes.

wouldn't have picked that in a million years from your posts (not having a go) but it makes me happy! LDP pretty much always get my first preference when they run a candidate.
04:29pm 17/11/11 Permalink
Hogfather
Cairns, Queensland
11285 posts
So if you vote for any one other then the coalition you are a labor voter ?

Way to jump on a poorly phrased question. In can you;re dense (and maybe you are) I was asking about your voting history and preferences.
Sure you did (it sounds a bit like when a racist uses some of my friends have dark skin as a defence) ... but beyond that Relavence ?

Relevance to assertion of being right wing. Did you just equate a conservative political position to racism? Just when I thought your trolling couldn't be more overt.

I'm out anyway, talking to you is a bit like debating with Nerf, best done in very, very small doses.
04:38pm 17/11/11 Permalink
Obes
Brisbane, Queensland
9451 posts

seriously?! fuck yeah, go obes.

wouldn't have picked that in a million years from your posts (not having a go) but it makes me happy! LDP pretty much always get my first preference when they run a candidate.

Well I quite like their voucher system for education (imo extend it to health as well). The state based education system is actually quite expensive per head when compared with many private providers (despite what myschools will tell you). And a voucher system would enable good "voucher based" schools to charge a little more and pay their staff more... performance pay for teachers with out stupid national standardised exams people will cheat. And would end up costing less even if it continued to provide a free education (and the quality of education would probably be better).

Most of their other stuff I agree with (except the shooter rights, no city slicker needs a gun). Tho I am not sure how you sell off a government monopoly with out creating a monopoly (but I am sure it's doable). And it's certainly more logical than selling half a monopoly. Where I differ I guess is that I believe that sometimes governments do need to invest in expensive infrastructure in the first place (then sell it off).

The Sex Party is up there as well, but they will never be taken seriously.

Now if only a party would have a platform to ban news.com.au and reform the AMA... Oh and get rid of 1 of our 3 tiers of government (I'd pick state, but constituionally that's difficult).

But being a realist, that shit (including minor parties) ain't ever going to happen.
It's red vs. blue and neither of them are really that different.

I get why you think what you think I think. I probably don't express my vague ok-ness with the carbon tax etc, very well.
Liberal or Labor they are both going to pay 100's of thousands to keep people past their working life in ICUs/expensive medical procedures etc etc etc. And I would rather that they raised that money by taxing something like future long term damage (ie. CO2 is polution and long term any pollution is something we should try to avoid, mining it's taking from the country for the benefit of so few and usually we the tax payers are propping up the infrastructure).
Rather than how hard Jo Schmo works, or how much money someone makes.

I am actually surprised Hoggy hadn't painted me a green supporter (because I do have a rather large vege patch).
05:43pm 17/11/11 Permalink
Ivonin
Brisbane, Queensland
879 posts
Fuck you all, I'm voting Katter. 'nuff said.
07:54pm 17/11/11 Permalink
FaceMan
Brisbane, Queensland
7590 posts
No Upper House in QLD which means Katter is likely going to decide who runs the State. The LNP are unlikely to beat Labor and The Australia Party.

The Coal Seam Gas thing is a huge vote winner for Katters Party.
08:12pm 17/11/11 Permalink
paveway
Brisbane, Queensland
15653 posts
Oh and get rid of 1 of our 3 tiers of government (I'd pick state, but constituionally that's difficult).


state is the only one you could get rid of really and as you said they are pretty well locked in forever constitutionally
09:02pm 17/11/11 Permalink
FaceMan
Brisbane, Queensland
7595 posts
But if Australia was reborn as a Republic couldnt the States be abolished ?

I too am in favour of getting rid of State Governments or Councils.
In fact Im in favour of Smaller Government - Lower Taxes.
Big Government is too wasteful.
11:26pm 17/11/11 Permalink
Scooter
Brisbane, Queensland
5132 posts
We could easily lose the sate (and most of the Local) without any harm done to any citizen.

I can't see what is so bad about Coal Seam gas mining as long as all current checks and balances are kept in place... I'm all for pursuing renewable energy but I still think we should use any/all cheap energy when and where we can until we get there.
11:37pm 17/11/11 Permalink
Rawprawn
Brisbane, Queensland
119 posts
I get that a lot with yo mommas... but I don't understand what she likes about me because the next thing you're saying seems to be pro-Liberal, which I most defnitely am not


I really need to stay away from this forum after a big dinner and lots of wines. Discombobulated thoughts and all that. Was merely attempting to convey that she appreciated your train of thought in previous posts. Not sure what you're referring to in my post that was pro liberal. If anything I was pointing out that, that whole side of the parliament is extremely negative and how that degrades anything said. They sound like a bunch of school boys having a go at each other, and it becomes very difficult to take them seriously.
I don't think the old ma has ever been a Liberal voter haha
04:09am 19/11/11 Permalink
paveway
Brisbane, Queensland
15668 posts
I too am in favour of getting rid of State Governments or Councils.


you'd still always need that sort of local level of government, even if it were state people still operating as the council with set boundaries that they looked after just like a council.

there is a lot of small stuff council look after like more detailed planning and development of their areas that state gov would just be massively burdened with if it was all handed to them. yes there are state and regional planning policies etc and they overarch the council ones but they are very vague

i don't think australia would be 're-born' as a republic, a repuclican model would be integrated into our constitution. and that constituuion was written by by the states way back when making them number 1 top dog. the need for a federal government came later out of necessity

it was fucking bad enough when they merged the local councils

the machine is to big to be destroyed now

last edited by paveway at 09:06:51 19/Nov/11

last edited by paveway at 09:08:15 19/Nov/11

last edited by paveway at 09:09:13 19/Nov/11
09:05am 19/11/11 Permalink
trog
AGN Admin
Brisbane, Queensland
35097 posts
If anything I was pointing out that, that whole side of the parliament is extremely negative and how that degrades anything said.
That is my biggest complaint as the two party system draws closer. Everything is a false dichotomy. One party pitches their ideas and the only thing the other party ever seems to do is just oppose them and whine about them.

I realise they are called the opposition for a reason, but contrarian politics is irritating. Some of the ideas that the government has must be at least somewhat decent.

I don't know if I just notice it more with Abbott or if he genuinely does it more regularly, but it really irks me about him as the leader of LNP.
10:43am 19/11/11 Permalink
FaceMan
Brisbane, Queensland
7611 posts
THEY ARE THE OPPOSITION
THEY OPPOSE THE GOVERNMENT

Beazley was a negative nelly when he lead the opposition.
If the opposition rolled over on too many bills what would be the point of voting for them ?
12:20pm 19/11/11 Permalink
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