My local subaru dealer is selling them quicker than they can get them in. if I wasn't still fairly early in my lease I would serious consider trading in for one.

here's a pretty good youtube video showing it head to head with a mustang

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pD3hgleEOXA

I'm confused. Are they the same car?

I'm confused. Are they the same car?

BRZ vs 86?

Essentially yes, minor differences :P

couldn't agree more scooby i have never, ever given a shit about owning a new car. until now.

How much are they in aus?

The BRZ is $37,150 drive away acording to the Subaru web site

good good
bring back non-massive rwd sedans too pls

This. I went looking for another car last year or whatever, bugger all medium sized RWD cars.

I wants. But I guess not anytime soon :(

Took the only [demo] GT in the ACT for a test drive two weeks back.

Very 'precise' driving controls, low driving position and reasonable throttle response (was an auto :\ but was a 6 speed auto too...)
A little underpowered (for the look of the car), but a VERY good balance when it came to power to weight, and you could tell exactly the market this car has been built for.

The '86 is ~33k on road for the GT and $43 for the GTS, but yeah, order an 86 GTS now and it's well into April-May locally before it'll arrive.

I want to see/feel the extra's in the GTS, coz the interior for the GT was v.spartan.

I also want to see how many of the 90's tuning giants return and make basic turbo kits etc etc for it. Apparently Toyota (and by extension Subaru (and Scion in the US)) are all 'at work' to produce a model with forced induction, that car, will be a weapon, and a menace to tyres EVERYwhere :D

Saw one not long ago and was wondering wtf it was no badge on back cept a toyota one

just fyi the gts is not the trd edition. the trd edition has nit been released yet and comes with waaay more goodies than the gts

Bets for 50k? lol

Do not want either. Could piss in a bucket with more power than this.

18month waiting list is marketing crap, it is currently looking like most people will have no more than a 5 month wait (mate paid for his on friday and dealer is expecting it to land mid nov, so in his late late november, however they are ramping up the building, so the wait might be less

(the 18 month wait was working out on the pre-delivery build times, but as the line in getting into full swing the numbers being made now is much much higher)

also, beware of the different prices, the toyota come in two specs, while the subie come in one, and while the subie looks higher, that is a driveaway price, AND includes some servicing


some of the guys I used to race with had three 86's at mt cotton last week, and they could not speak, they are still most likely grinning ear to ear, it was (and i'l para phrase here) a fucking hoot, so damn controlable, and nice to not have the idiot savers (aka all the electronics that control modern cars, and take the fun out)

one of the guys (whom i'll not name due to some damage to the car that no one would claim did it) took it dirt......it did really really well (for a rwd) so much so that he is thinking of competing in one once more spares come online (he drives rally) one comment was the ride was really good for a fun sporty car, and much better than he thought it would be off road so i can only guess that it will be rather good as a daily

none of them liked the back seat

I reckon wait 5 years when the second hand market gets a hold of them. prices will plummet and bring everything down as-well. there is talk of Nissan lowering the price of there 370 to compete with the ft/brz.
Also Mazda have just announced a partnership with alpha to make the ND generation of mx5, still going to be around the $45k mark. Which mazda believes is an affordable sports car. But in saying that Porsche think the Cayman is affordable too.
I have my roadster so its all good.

I've seen a couple of these on the road and they do look a lot better in person.

What do these things have that make em so expensive? It's a 4 cylinder na right?

It'd be properly rage inducing for a commuter, but tbh I think I'd drive that like I ride my bike; have a destination in mind, but find as many twisty streets between here and there as I could think to ;)

I drive my evo to work some times, it handles better in stop start gridlock than my toyota corolla daily driver lolz.

it's just a murano motor right?

dunno, maybe it is but they're not the same car, it's not just the engine. I know for sure it's the same motor as the G35's. But in all seriousness, you can't compare a 350z or a honda s2000 to an 86. You're comparing apples to oranges. But that's not too say the 86 is a bad car, I actually like it a lot, but severly lacks straight line pull (which can be corrected with some bolt ons ;) )

Oh I read somewhere that Subaru may be introducing an STI version, sounds exciting!

What happens when you lose traction in a FWD?

you learn how to control a fwd

I thought understeer would be safer than oversteer. Unless you are a skilled driver or an internet user that is.

FWD cars are easier and safer for your average driver.

Grip doesn't necessarily equate to all out ideal 'handling characteristics' skythra.
I'm refering to cornering specifically, not 'straight line' performance.

FWD allows people to get away with murder (ie, enter a corner waaaay too hot and the outcome is very predictable) (I agree with Strik3r on this point, for 'everyday drivers' this is probably the safest and most predictable)
RWD allows for more 'fun' with the throttle (ie, enter slowly, hard exit will step the tail out, and 'on [but not over] the limit' this is where fun is had)

AWD allows for best 'all weather' grip, but when it comes to cornering, unless said A/4WD has an awesome Centre Diff or variable Diff they *tend* to understeer. Breaking traction in an AWD on roads otherwise (ie, enter a corner too hard, attempt to push car beyond limit and lose traction) will typically end up in far worse situation than someone 'playing' in a RWD.

Regardless of F/R/A/4 WD unless you've got some decent (read not cheap) rubber, well set suspension and a decent Diff it doesn't really matter. For 'everyday driving' it's a non-event, but for those who really enjoy driving for *drivings sake* most people tend toward RWD. (as I see it, there's the most room for 'finesse' with an RWD)

EDIT: re-reading that first sentence (of this post) and it looks wrong... I guess what I'm trying to say is grip only makes up one part of the equation when it comes to cornering. In moving a car through a corner at speed, there are a lot of factors to consider, weight (and its balance), where the power is coming from, and how you seek to apply it. I've got plenty of on and off-road experience, (not tonnes of track work, but enough I think) what I don't have in spades is the ability to quickly and concisely word it I guess :P

Scuzzy is over 6foot and drives a toyota sera, i think you'd feel more comfortable in a 86 than he does in that sera :P

And as for the AWD FWD RWD, i'm just meaning in safety on average user scenarios. When turning in a situation, around the streets or on the road, a FWD is going to have more meaningful grip. Although I didn't qualify that specifically.

For a sports car driver, safety isn't paramount to speed and function. RWD can at speed take a corner faster than a FWD. Hence RWD is better, you make up the safety part with skill.

Also all things being equal, obviously a slow rwd or a commodore without any suspension will roll badly and corner much slower than an integra with a turbo and coilovers despite being fwd.

On the one hand, thats a pretty sweet looking car, I liked it when my brother showed it to me a few months back. But if its going to herald in a new age of people driving on the roads like idiots because they think they're badass race car drivers in their "sports" cars, then fuck that car, it can go diaf.

I had that thought too Khel, if I were in the market to own one I don't think it would stop me, but yeah, the demographic of 'omogod eets fully schick' dudes that would own it (and the rapidly growing number of them that will be on the road) is a bit of a downer.

Overall I think the 'car market' should stand up and take notice tho, not everyone wants a massively heavy road car, or $50k+ sports car

lol's at people thinking that there is no control in a fwd car that is skidding

for the record a fwd is safer to control, if you start to understeer all you do is square up the corner, simple shit that doesn't require you practice those skills (sure you have to know the skills in the first place) (controling a RWD car on the true limit, and regaining control is it steps out (not drifting, proper lose control) is much much hard in a RWD (and pretty much never ever going to happen in a 911)

On the one hand, thats a pretty sweet looking car, I liked it when my brother showed it to me a few months back. But if its going to herald in a new age of people driving on the roads like idiots because they think they're badass race car drivers in their "sports" cars, then fuck that car, it can go diaf.

Right. Because all the people who can already get cars modified for far cheaper with more power to weight aren't already doing that.

You're just hating with no substance khel. Did you give up the internet just because dicks post all the time?

lol's at people thinking that there is no control in a fwd car that is skidding

I don't think even 1 person said that, but if you can quote and prove me wrong?

There was a brief difference of opinion of how much one was easier to manage in difficult situations. I can tell you that given pure aquaplane i've pulled grip by planting my foot in a frontwheel drive car but it'd be impossible to do that in a RWD. But again have to rest on AWD as being better for that situation although i can't say i've driven one in that situation (although i have driven both rwd and fwd cars in that situation).

Really tyres are more important than rwd vs fwd but it's kind of a dumb comparison anyway.

You're just hating with no substance khel. Did you give up the internet just because dicks post all the time?

I'm not hating on the car, I'm just hating on wankers in general. And I'm worried this might become a wanker magnet, which would suck, cos I wouldn't mind one at some point in the future possibly.

I'm not hating on the car, I'm just hating on wankers in general. And I'm worried this might become a wanker magnet, which would suck, cos I wouldn't mind one at some point in the future possibly.

I reckon every man and his dog will have this car. They're gonna be everywhere and more common than a corolla. I think the appeal will be shortlived. Because of this it should make your more expensive sports cars eg. 350Z more unique and desirable ;P

Oh and whoever said that because of the release of the 86, this might bring on the release of the next supra. I actually think the opposite, this has dampened the chances of such a thing!!

Having said that, seeing the succes of the 86, they might release a much more powerful supra to compete with the more expensive sports car market.

By the way, you can't compare the 86 to an mx5, the mx5 is a convertible meaning huge cost impact hence the price tag.

last edited by maRtz at 05:31:55 24/Jul/12

7.6 rly? how come people are spooging about a car that's slower from 0-100 than a 2300kg bmw X5 diesel

derp
how about snappy acceleration, which 0-100 is a reasonable measure of for the australian market?

:(
not shitting on the car in general, just surprised at the power given the attention it's getting

How much is the X5, $50k more?

I would have thought 0-100 in 7.6 in more than adequate to zip around in :/

pulled in behind one of the 86's today, looks sexy as, not much sound from it tho :( unless oldmate wasnt giving it any.

having driven a mps plenty of times i would call bullshit on your statement spook, between the dynamic stability control and traction control i'd reckon a mps would hand this 86 a beating

the only failure with the mps is taking off from standing still it will torque steer a fair bit

yer, i read some wheels review on hot hatches and all the drivers said the same thing, the mps was great in a straight line, and shit through corners.

the 86 definately seems under powered, but you cant deny its fast through corners, much faster than anything else in or even in most cases above its price range

theres a lot of people tracking these cars already and loving them, so it must be doing enough.

no doubt there will be a more hipowered version coming though

7.6 is pretty weak 1-100 :/
first company to bring out a reasonably priced bolt on turbo/procharger etc will make a fortune.

That's a ridiculous price for a turbo kit. imagine that in aus dollars after importing + install..

mmmm i dont know about that MPS comment. I drove a friends stock turbo 6 speed mps through glorious one night (trac on and off) and it was seriously quick around corners if you drove it hard. I have been up there in alot of different cars (mainly imports) and it was without a doubt the quickest car ive taken up there. Hell it would DESTORY my supra with almost everything done.

quick, and feeling quick can sometimes be different

the MPS like all FWD cars hits a limit that all FWD cars do, and that it steering and feeding power thru the same tyres

two cars with like power and like tyres but different ends driving, the RWD will always be able to hold a higher top corner speed, the FWD will be able to get on the power a little earlier on exit, but it has to brake earlier and has a lower overall corner speed,

the 86 is faster mid corner despite having less tyre (width) than the mazda, and less power, but because of it's balance and low CG it will kill an MPS

I've seen a stock mx5 vs an MPS around lakeside 2 years ago, and the MPS while fast down the straight was caught up, and overtaken without fail by the eastern loop, (and once by the old bridge) yet the MPS is faster than an MX5

86 vs MPS - it will depend on the track. Lots of slow corners and big straights will favour MPS heavily. Sweeping track will favour 86/BRZ cause it can keep the average speed up.

no pave, because they got to a point were the gearboxes couldn't take the extra power,

er, it is about keeping the weight down,

stronger gearboxes are heavier, more weight makes the car slow, and the the handling pooer, adding a turbo isn't going to fix the degradation to the handling because of the added weight

also, stronger gearboxes add cost, (which is the main reason they have gone with the one in the 86/brz)

so it is fucking harder

How much heavier would a heavier duty gearbox be?

I saw one of these getting around yesterday. Was I imagining things?Bogan boat ftw! (i have one)I read an interesting question/answer thread by a guy who reviews cars for a magazine in europe and his favourite get-about car to dive was the mx5. Before that I always thought they weren't great.

Miatas are Great.

I recently bough one. (Grey)
Dad drove it for a while and then he bought one too!(white)

I have front and Rear sway bars, Full custom exhaust(cat back extractors etc) and king springs, so mine handles a bit bettter then his.

OT: Still if I was offered a FT 86 or a Ae86 worth the RRP of an FT, Id take the AE any day,

only downside to the MX5 is the cost, 51k drive away15k less gets you a 86/BRZ, hopefully this will bring down the price of the MX5, (and some of the hot hatchs) secretly I would love a good rwd revival, a little something from the VW group to compete with BMW,

For a brand new NC model MX5.
Personally, I think they look like arse,

Saw one of these on the road today and looked pretty darn good.. then read here it does 0-100 in 7.6 seconds - how underwhelming for a car that looks as good as it is. For the asking price there's plenty of other cars out there that would out perform it (in all areas, not just straight line speed).Edit:8.2 seconds ... Miss Daisy would even get annoyed at that.

A 1989 MX5 can do 0-100 in 8.1, thats a 23 year old car.

40 more kgs? lol

Wouldn't a heavier duty clutch and a stronger forged 1st gear be sufficient? Wouldn't turbo an auto though.

most important question.. will it sound like a wrxy if I put a cannon on it? bro? uleh?

Why would toyota care about a turbo version? They're already selling these things like they're hotcakes. Obviously they've hit the right spot in the market.

literally just got back from a test drive of the gts sports auto. it looks gorgeous, i've never liked automatics, but you can paddle shift the gears. the interior's leather is gorgeous. i'm six feet tall and had about 4-5 inches clear sitting in the bucket seat.

the handling is phenominal. the only thing i've driven that i can compare it to is the mx-5. and slow? i didn't notice. needless to say i'm buying one (manual though)

also, spoke to the salesman, toyota is collaborating with bmw for a 2 new sports cars, one of which is the supra. 2015 estimated arrival.

dont see why they are bothering with a new mr2 tho, they where shit back in the day and still are.

went down to look at the car in person today..

yeah there's no way i'm going to be able to drive it and be comfortable. So while it looks cool - it's too far out of the practical barrier. I need the seat down to minimum height and fully extended to not have my head hit the roof or my knees hit the dash

if it was about 1.3x bigger it would be better for me

If he's that tall, he's probably lost all the power to weight ratio anyway..