Hi guys, long story long, I've had a "pool fence style" double gate installed at my place by a mob [name removed]. Initially I wasn't happy as the gate was supposed to open "inwards" rather than "outwards" but I mis-read their sketch which I had approved. They pointed out to my error and I said that's fine, I've fucked up and I'll pay to rectify it, no issues. So otherwise everything looked sweet and I paid them for the work and I was waiting for a second quote to make the gate open "inwards". In the meantime, upon closer inspection I noticed that the welds are fucking atrocious in comparison to the existing fencing/gate done by "others" (and by my own standards). They looked like something that was done by someone who's never welded before. I told him I wasn't happy about it and he said that in 8 years he's never had a complaint and that I'm disgraceful for doing so and he hung up on me. I've tried to resolve the matter in an amicable manner but again hung up on me.
All I expected him to do was when the gate went back for rework, to simply get a grinder and smooth out all the bad looking welds, doesn't take long and it's not a big fucking deal.
At this point I'm quite furious about it and I realise he's not going to make that gate swing the other way (I don't want him to) but at least I want the cunt to fix the welds or pay to have it done by someone else or by me, whatever. Anything I can do?
[name of company removed; doesn't seem to add anything]
How bad could the welds really look if you had looked the job over and paid for it? Ask yourself if it will matter in 12 months. If the answer is no, move on. Life is too short. If the answer is yes, then take your complaint to the BSA. Just be sure that the issue is a real one and its not you who is being a cunt. (I'm not saying you are BTW)
How bad could the welds really look if you had looked the job over and paid for it? Ask yourself if it will matter in 12 months. If the answer is no, move on. Life is too short. If the answer is yes, then take your complaint to the BSA. Just be sure that the issue is a real one and its not you who is being a cunt. (I'm not saying you are BTW)
This.
Also need pics of welds, there's shitty welds and then there's shitty welds. Is the fence powder coated?
Mort. Its not a Fair trading issue bud. If there is a true problem with job, the governing authority is the BSA. I've just checked the builder s history and he has no recorded issues in any category.
that is pretty much your only choice, unless it is worth lawyering up and suing proper but i doubt it is
as ET though, are the welds actually that bad? do you honestly think the fence is going to fall apart because of the weld because they aren't real neat or something?
I've just checked the builder s history and he has no recorded issues in any category.
The builders themselves might not, their website designer must have a tonne of complaints though. Their website is shit. Tiny little column in the middle of the page, individual scroll bars for each item? Welcome to geocities, circa1990.
that is pretty much your only choice, unless it is worth lawyering up and suing proper but i doubt it isas ET though, are the welds actually that bad? do you honestly think the fence is going to fall apart because of the weld because they aren't real neat or something?
I have a pool fence as my front fence, welds are all chunky looking but it's plenty strong enough. Only thing I've had break is the plastic hinge when some drunk cuntface teenagers ripped the gate off & threw it in the middle of the road.
To be honest you sound like you are trying to weasel out of paying, that might not be what you intend but you are showing the classic symptoms. You made an issue out of something that wasn't the contractors fault with the gate, they had to point out it was on the plans for you to accept that. Once you did accept that though you turned around and found something innocuous to then take exception to.
The first could have been an honest misunderstanding but the second time would definitely raise a flag for any contractor and perhaps this one has been bitten enough before that he has already decided that you plan to screw him over.
I paid a deposit up front to get the ball rolling, paid the rest after job was done. Mind you they were very pushy for payment, and even sounded annoyed that I didn't pay on the day that it was done (I was at work and didn't see the fence till the evening after I got home).
The welding is structurally sound but looks ugly and is of very poor quality. I'm actually surprised they let the gates go for powder coating as they are, a simple quick touch up with the grinder would have it sorted. These sort of jobs are meant to look good, that's the point but the welding when standing close looks shit. I'll take pics in the morning. Maybe I don't have a case at all, just upset at the quality.
I suppose you googled the builder first to see if he was good quality ?
No ?
two lessons learnt.
google was how I found them, and what was the first lesson?
who stands a foot from their fence at all times though? you honestly sound like the type of person who would buy a car, drive it for a week then go back and bitch that the brake callipers aren't red enough.
I dunno, from the fuss you're making are you SURE it's not as bad as the shitty black grate?
Or is the issue that gate X welded by company A doesn't exactly match gate Y welded by company B (and the boogey woogey bugle boy) and the welds are actually quite acceptable.
1st pic are standard tabbing welds... Second pic well, they are dirty welds, maybe too much stick used. But it could be worse. It could have burn holes all over it.
From the sounds of it they've left what you call dogshit on the welds. If you are a fencer who makes his living doing this over a period of at least 8 years(?), you shouldn't be leaving that shit on the welds.. Having said that, unless you were pretty specific on the actual "finish" of the welding I really can't see how you can get him. Just grab a 5" with a wire brush and take the crap off the top, welds will come up sweet and will take you maybe 40 minutes if your unlucky..
it's a grate in a driveway herbal, who gives a shit what it looks like? long as it holds my car I don't care. This isn't about me anyway.
From the sounds of it they've left what you call dogshit on the welds. If you are a fencer who makes his living doing this over a period of at least 8 years(?), you shouldn't be leaving that shit on the welds..Having said that, unless you were pretty specific on the actual "finish" of the welding I really can't see how you can get him. Just grab a 5" with a wire brush and take the crap off the top, welds will come up sweet and will take you maybe 40 minutes if your unlucky..
unless his fence is powder coated in which case he's going to rub off the powder coat and be left with an even worse finish.
In any case, this is all just heresay without him actually manning up and posting pictures like he said he would.
Sorry, had to work today and straight after had things on with wife and kids..
Ok so after 8 years of experience, this is what I get, blotchy welds, spatter everywhere, fucken ugly.
Note that in a couple pics there is a fugly drilled hole, wtf is that there for? It was done after the powder coating! Also notice the fucked powder coating bti.
And this is what they should look like (existing fence/gate by I don't know who):
Yeah that is pretty shit and the drilled hole is definitely a massive wtf. By looking at it the welds on the poles are also pretty far from structurally sound. That's a lot more than just unclean welding. I'm out, good luck with that :(
LIAR! You said it didn't look as bad as the shitty grate I posted. It does so look as bad.
Ok so after 8 years of experience
Just because the company has been making them for 8 years, doesn't mean whoever welded them has been there that long. Could have been an apprentice or something.
LIAR! You said it didn't look as bad as the shitty grate I posted. It does so look as bad.Just because the company has been making them for 8 years, doesn't mean whoever welded them has been there that long. Could have been an apprentice or something.
I know that, just being a prick :)
He's got a little workshop (have to check website for address) where I assume he's got some noob apprentice or the like and he goes out and does all the quoting and installations.
He's not welding that, he's cutting it (and sitting on the wrong side lol)
I wish I had this guys balls / skillz
Welding on a live line can be kind of stressful to say the least! We had an evacuation plan in effect should we burn through the pipe and gas was released. Fortunately everything went as it should! H2S is one of the most lethal gasses known to man and should you encounter it even in low concentrations it can kill within seconds. The British used it as a chemical weapon during WW1.
man get real, you paid for a fence that meets the aust. standards for pool fencing, he gave you that - its not supposed to be a work of art... way to be a dickhead customer
man get real, you paid for a fence that meets the aust. standards for pool fencing, he gave you that - its not supposed to be a work of art... way to be a dickhead customer
I hope the next time you get food, it's "barely meeting australian standards".
wanting a decent job not a shit one, isn't being a dickhead customer imo
I'm half with you, half with scooby. Yeah they could have done a better job on it and probably should have but it' just a fence, not some art piece destined for a museum. How close would you have to even stand to see those shitty welds? How many people are going to sit there a foot from the fence & go hmm this fence looks dodgy.
I hope the next time you get food, it's "barely meeting australian standards".
Totally different. Both the good looking fence and the crap looking one have the same types of welds, just one looks more pretty than the other. What you're saying would be more like getting a sandwich and one looks better than the other, even though they both taste exactly the same and are both safe to eat.
e: as for that hole, sometimes the coaters will drill holes to hang things. It might not have been put there by whoever made it.
there is a slap dah job, then there is a shity job, and this is somewhere in between
the old saying "you get what you pay for" might be the deciding factor,
if you have paid for a low cost job, or the cheapest quote you got. then the only thing I would be hitting him up for is the drill hole in the powder coating, (my guess is that it is a drain hole but imo it should be bear metal)
now if you have paid alot of money (compared to say other quotes for the same job) then yes, go after the dude, it isn't of a high standard
Those welds are feral! Looks like an incorrecly setup mig run by a less than useful operator who moved too quickly. The welder is too cold hence the lack of smooth contour and the globular appearence. I'd go off too, makes the entire thing look tacky. As for the holes, when you hot dip gal something they are necessary to stop the tube exploding, don't know much about powder coating though! : )
yea theres another question, was this fella the cheapest quote you got? if so, shut up.
if you paid more than the cheapest quote you got in choosing this guy in the hope for a higher quality of fence artwork, then i guess you have an argument and you can explain this to him.
yea i do have the same attitude to my AC business, its not supposed to be a fucking da Vinci art piece, my prices are cheap, it will cool your room and it comes with warranty now pay me and shut up have a nice day
yea theres another question, was this fella the cheapest quote you got? if so, shut up.
This just isn't right at all.
Most tradies do a fucking terrible job regardless of price so why pay more.
(That's not pointed at you)
Last decent tradie I had (who was cheapest) went on to get nearly $20k worth of other jobs from relatives alone, some of which I know passed on to friends.
Doing a shitty job just shows you don't care about doing a good one. Nobody will recommend someone doing a shitty job.
Pretty sure most businesses don't do well or turn multi-million or billion dollar companies by starting off doing shitty work, it may slide after it becomes so successful though. But it has the capacity to afford to be able to.
If you just want a mediocre business, do a mediocre job.
yea i do have the same attitude to my AC business, its not supposed to be a fucking da Vinci art piece, it will cool your room and it comes with warranty now pay me and shut up
It's quite a challenge to find people who have pride in their work.
Having once done two weeks of Welding with Stick and MIG, in my expert opinion, it appears to be a mix of both. Thats some pretty ordinary welds done in a hurry but Ive seen far worse.
Pretty shithouse attitude if you ask me. The guy deserves to go broke.
And also: I know it doesn't help you now, but ALWAYS leave money swinging on a job. It's the only way you will ever get a tradesman back. After they have been paid they won't want to know you.
In highschool during shop, if someone did that they'd have to start again. I can't even begin to imagine how a grown adult can weld worse than a year 10 kid.
admittedly welding aluminium pipe is a tad harder than plate steel but srsly. the slag everywhere and welds that don't penetrate are pretty indicative of not knowing what the fuck.
admittedly welding aluminium pipe is a tad harder than plate steel but srsly. the slag everywhere and welds that don't penetrate are pretty indicative of not knowing what the fuck.
The drilled holes are fresh (done after powder coating). This work was quite expensive, over $800, I thought I was getting quality by paying more.
On Friday I had an AC installed, I got 3 quotes, 2 of them were around the $2600 mark and the other one was around $2058 or something like. I said fuck it, get the cheapest one (if I pay top dollar and get a shit gate, then I'll go cheap this time). I was a bit nervous but when I got home and inspected the job, I couldn't be happier and was really impressed with the quality of work and customer service. Actually in addition to this, the installer called me and suggested a better way of installing it than I had asked them to, it took them longer but no additional cost. Was pleasantly surprised they went that extra mile and they were the cheapest!!
yea theres another question, was this fella the cheapest quote you got? if so, shut up.
So with my aircon experience, I have to disagree with this.
oh and the latest!! 2 of the welds are cracked!! (hard to take photo's of):
Call whoever is in charge of pool fencing? Council? Tell them this is what he did, he'd probably be more encouraged to fix it if he had a federal body crawling up his ass.
It looks like an incorrect stick type or liner feed to quick at Max Amp
That's why I asked what type of welder was used. Any numpty can weld with a MIG so long as it's set up correctly. I doubt they'd use stick, having to keep on putting in new sticks would = waste of time = loss of money.
Reminds me of what happens at work. Other guy there comes to use the MIG and either blows holes in shit, or gets welds like that (which he then has to fix lololololo) because I've changed the settings and he's forgotten to check.
:( of course it's cracking off
most of those welds looked as useful as a blob of blutac. actually less, because the blutac would still sort of hold the pipe in place.
Maybe try a pool safety inspector : http://www.aegissafe.com.au/pool-inspections/ found it on google. Get them to give you a certificate saying the welds are unreliable and the fence must be remade or something & then go to this guy's workshop in person so he can't just hang up on you. Either take a friend as a witness or record the conversation (and notify him you're recording it).
Just showed the photos to someone who works for a large fencing company... was told those welds are utter rubbish and would not be acceptable at their company.
lol at getting the cheaper A/C job. It may look good to you but I bet you there's things that haven't been done properly. My mate see's it all the time, sure another mob has quoted $300 less, but they've left shit out etc.
Thanks Protius, I'll let you know when something goes wrong (if it does). Just because I went with a cheaper quote doesn't necessarily mean that they did a shit job. Maybe that's just their price for doing the work, or maybe they are quiet and desperate for work.
I used your mentality and went with the most expensive quote for the gate and look how it ended up for me.
other was 700 or something. No idea how long it took to install, I wasn't there and I think my missus was out of the house most of the day anyway. The fence wasn't really "made to match" it's a pretty standard fence design. This is all beside the point though.
Sorry, looks like a pool fence / thought I saw a pool. In that case I guess your only option is to take as many photos of their gate and the other fence / gate and take them to small claims court.
man they are some shit welds. i wouldn't accept that work either. assuming he used electrodes for this either he got the apprentice to weld it and it was his first day and never welded before or he was using a mig with the wrong gas or has a leak or something. as you can see from the corner weld the weld pool looks like he started sort of ok but just fucked it up half way through. like the existing welds on your other fence it should be consistent along the whole weld and anyone telling you different is full of it.
so if I go to small claims, I have to get a few quotes to fix the 2 cracked welds and re-powder coat?? The other welds are atrocious but not sure if I can claim the repair of those too? I could say that I'm worried about them cracking in the future which I am concerned about.
I want to but this is exactly what he wants, for me to just let it go. Plus I feel really cheated and treated like shit.
I spoke to him again this morning after I sent him photo's of the cracked welds and he said they weren't like that after welding and coating and that the welds are done to Australian standards. If it was to Aus Standards I would have to smack the tube really hard with a hammer or pull the tube so hard it would bend to make the weld crack.
martz, I came across these guys yesterday: http://www.handlemycomplaint.com.au/ . They might be worth getting in touch with to handle the heavy lifting?
I spoke to him again this morning after I sent him photo's of the cracked welds and he said they weren't like that after welding and coating and that the welds are done to Australian standards. If it was to Aus Standards I would have to smack the tube really hard with a hammer or pull the tube so hard it would bend to make the weld crack.
Even if it is to Australian standards, whatever that means, I would think that a gate that falls apart is not fit for purpose.
he said they weren't like that after welding and coating and that the welds are done to Australian standards.
Yeah I get it - you've come along later, done a bodgy welding job over the top of his awesome welding job, then done a second powder coat yourself just so you could complain? Sounds legit.
Good luck martz, my partner is a lawyer and I showed her for giggles.
This kind of stuff is the kind of thing most people let go, and that is what the assholes want. They do a sub-par job and then blame you for their failings to scare/bully you into leaving it alone.
Unfortunately they are the least rewarding when it comes to getting it fixed, if you take legal action you at best will get the cost to fix it, or have him fix it. Either way you'll be out the time/money for the legal costs.
My opinion is go after them, but that's because I dislike shithouse halfass jobs.
Also I'd never use scooby for A/C, he sounds like a tosser whose let a couple asshole customers get to him. Assuming that he even does a decent job in the first place. You get what you pay for is a stupid saying, reputation is more helpful, but even that isn't perfect =( So hard to get good work done sometimes.
Proper court and legal is a ball ache and expensive, especially small claims court. If you can get it sorted through a trade regulatory body or someone like Trog's 'handle my complaints' I reckon that'd be ideal.
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